Wednesday 1 August 1660
Up very early, and by water to Whitehall to my Lord’s, and there up to my Lord’s lodging (Wm. Howe being now ill of the gout at Mr. Pierce’s), and there talked with him about the affairs of the Navy, and how I was now to wait today at the Privy Seal. Commissioner Pett went with me, whom I desired to make my excuse at the office for my absence this day.
Hence to the Privy Seal Office, where I got (by Mr. Mathews’ means) possession of the books and table, but with some expectation of Baron’s bringing of a warrant from the King to have this month.
Nothing done this morning, Baron having spoke to Mr. Woodson and Groome (clerks to Mr. Trumbull of the Signet) to keep all work in their hands till the afternoon, at which time he expected to have his warrant from the King for this month.1
I took at noon Mr. Harper to the Leg in King Street, and did give him his dinner, who did still advise me much to act wholly myself at the Privy Seal, but I told him that I could not, because I had other business to take up my time.
In the afternoon at the office again, where we had many things to sign; and I went to the Council Chamber, and there got my Lord to sign the first bill, and the rest all myself; but received no money today. After I had signed all, I went with Dick Scobell and Luellin to drink at a bottle beer house in the Strand, and after staying there a while (had sent W. Hewer home before), I took boat and homewards went, and in Fish Street bought a Lobster, and as I had bought it I met with Winter and Mr. Delabarr, and there with a piece of sturgeon of theirs we went to the Sun Tavern in the street and ate them. Late home and to bed.
25 Annotations
First Reading
Paul Brewster • Link
Mr. Harper -> Mr. Hooper
per L&M: Mr. Hooper was an official of the Privy Seal.
Tim Bray • Link
"Bottle beer house?" Any insight on that?
Paul Brewster • Link
Bottle Beer House
Not much information on the location but ...
From a site we've referenced before:
http://www.shu.ac.uk/schools/cs/t…
"1630 Late 1630s, arrival of the beer bottle as viable"
The OED includes this quote:
"1641 French Distill. v. (1651) 122 It will tast as quick as bottle beer."
gerry • Link
L&M have Hooper for Harper and the Companion identifies him as William Hooper, a minor canon of Westminster Abbey.
Paul Brewster • Link
Diary entry: Mr. Harper (Wheatley) -> Mr. Hooper (L&M)
L&M Footnote to this entry says "An official of the Privy Seal"
On December 29th, 1661 Wheatley will introduce us to Mr. Hooper for the first and only time in the following context "I to the Abbey, and there meeting with Mr. Hooper, he took me in among the quire, and there I sang with them their service."
I think the L&M Companion ("William Hooper, a minor canon of Westminster Abbey.") may point to this other appearance. Without the index and/or the 1661 Volume of L&M to help me, I can't get much further. I cannot tell if L&M believes these are two folks with the same last name (only one of which is mentioned in the L&M Companion) or a single individual with two different jobs (one of which is not mentioned in the companion entry).
gerry • Link
Paul, I checked 12/29/61 and (its hardly a spoiler) Sam talks about meeting Mr. Hooper and going with him to the "Quire".From the context I guess it could be taken either way i.e. meeting someone he knew or meeting someone for the first time.
Mary • Link
The OED reference to bottle beer
is intriguing. If one takes 'quick' to mean 'alive, lively', this could mean that bottle(d) beer retained a bit more effervescence than the normal sort that was drawn from the keg. As any home-brewer will know, any beer bottled slightly too early can be very lively indeed ... sometimes dangerously so!
vincent • Link
Reading this again I do find it strange that poor Liz does not get to enjoy the finer foods:
Quire I presumed is a choir where the warbling is done, Now that the High Church is the Rage, Singing and c(H)anting is allowed. The change in attitudes are remarkable?
Maybe Beer in a bottle is made very local?, may be in the back yard (beyond the Privy) there fore no cask needed.
Mary • Link
Bottle beer again.
My impression is that Pepys is here making a distinction between the ordinary ale- or beer-house and this one, which serves bottle beer. As for brewing habits, see useful background information under food/drink/beer.
Glyn • Link
Does this mean that Mr Woodson and Mr Groome were finishing their month's work, and could have handed it over to Pepys that morning, but were asked by their friend Baron to delay things until the afternoon so he could get his hands on the warrant and that month's job? If so, it doesn't seemed to have worked. If it had succeeded, then presumably Pepys would have had no work there for at least a month.
Paul Brewster • Link
Does this mean that Mr Woodson and Mr Groome were finishing their month's work?
I don’t think so. My surmise (and it’s just that) is that the Signet and the Privy Seal were two steps in a multi-step process. Baron was trying to get W and G (SP specifically identifies them as belonging to the Signet Office) to hold up any work they would have normally passed on to the office of Privy Seal until he (Baron) had an opportunity to get his hands on the Privy Seal itself and thus get all the revenue that would normally have come to the clerk for an entire month. What seems clear is that this tactic, if it was even tried, didn’t seem to have any mentioned impact on SP’s revenue.
vincent • Link
The Signet is in the hands of the Chancellor and you need the signet ring to get the impression on the wax for validity and of course that has a value.
Second Reading
Terry Foreman • Link
"to Whitehall to my Lord’s, and there up to my Lord’s lodging"
The L&M Companion says of Mountagu's London quarters at this time: "he had an official residence ["my Lord's lodging" methinks] in Whitehall Palace, from 1653 until his death, which included part (or probably all) of the gatehouse of the King St. Gate, and rooms adjacent to it on both sides of the street. He also had official lodgings (1660-8) at the Wardrobe...."
Terry Foreman • Link
Paul Brewster and gerry, the Index shows two Hoopers (no given names), with the different roles as you posted here.
Terry Foreman • Link
"Wm. Howe being now ill of the gout" -- there will be a lot of gout in the diary and people who drink alcohol..
Gout is caused by having higher-than-normal levels of uric acid in your body. This may occur if:
- Your body makes too much uric acid
- Your body has a hard time getting rid of uric acid
If too much uric acid builds up in the fluid around the joints (synovial fluid), uric acid crystals form. These crystals cause the joint to swell and become inflamed.
The exact cause is unknown. Gout may run in families. The problem is more common in men, in women after menopause, and people who drink alcohol.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubme…
Bill • Link
"The problem is more common in ... people who drink alcohol."
We seem to have no lack of those people.
Dick Wilson • Link
The Lobster is not necessarily "fancy food", which Sam is failing to share with Elizabeth. In New England at this period, there were clauses in the indentures of servants, that said they would not be fed Lobster more than twice a week. Whether it was fancy food or not depended on local availability. I assume the lobster was alive, which means fresh!
Bottled Beer: I had no idea that this blessing was available at so early a date. What did the bottles look like? Who made them, and how? Presumably they were corked, not capped. Portuguese cork? If not, who supplied the cork? Did the house have an "Off License"? (i.e. take home beer) If you drank there, presumably they would re-use the bottles on site, and they might even wash off the outsides of the bottles. Did they charge you extra if you broke one?
Terry Foreman • Link
Meanwhile on this day in the New World in Montauk, East Hampton, Nassau Island
https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=4…
- On the first day of August, 1660, and after the death of the Sachem Wyandanch, his widow, called the Squa-Sachem,
- and her son, united in a deed of confirmation to the original purchasers for the lands of Montauk ; and described by
- them as extending from sea to sea, and from the easternmost parts thereof to the bounds of Easthampton, for the
- consideration of one hundred pounds, to be paid in ten equal annual payments in Indian corn or good wampum at six
- to a penny. http://books.google.com/books?vid…
Background: Montauk derives its name from the Montaukett tribe, an Algonquian-speaking tribe who lived in the area.
In 1653, Narragansetts under Ninigret attacked and burned the Montaukett village, killing 30 and capturing one of Chief Wyandanch's daughters. The daughter was recovered with the aid of Lion Gardiner (who in turn was given a large portion of Smithtown, New York in appreciation). The Montauketts, ravaged by smallpox and fearing extermination by the Narragansetts, were provided temporary refuge by white settlers in East Hampton....Further purchase agreements were entered into in 1661, 1672 and 1686 which, among other things, allowed a group of Easthampton townsmen to graze cattle on the Montaukett lands...As a result...Montauk...is considered to be the oldest cattle ranch in the United States. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mon…
meech • Link
Regarding the lobster, it almost sounds as if he bought the lobster on the way home, but then ran into two friends buying sturgeon, so they all ate together. Makes me wonder if his original intention was to take it home to share with his wife. But even if not, it is another example of the irregularity of his comings and goings at home and makes me wonder how she would know when or whether to prepare something for his dinner. He conducts himself more like a single man than a married one, and seems to come and go as it suits him.
Jim Veihdeffer • Link
I'm brand new to this site so I'm not quite sure how to post my question but here goes: Throughout the diaries I read that Pepys is either giving someone their "morning draught" or "giving them their dinner" (or sometimes reversed). Does this mean Pepys is actually buying the morning drink or dinner for someone...or is it a more general term, like "going to dinner together" or "having the morning drink together"?
San Diego Sarah • Link
Welcome aboard, Jim. A rule of thumb to save you a lot of confusion: Believe what Pepys writes. If he says he paid for it, he paid for it. Most of the time we just don't know.
"I took at noon Mr. Harper to the Leg in King Street, and did give him his dinner, who did still advise me much to act wholly myself at the Privy Seal, but I told him that I could not, because I had other business to take up my time."
In this case, since Pepys is seeking advice, I think he paid for their lunch. You and I would do the same.
Jim Veihdeffer • Link
Thanks SD Sarah (I actually didn't know how to find if someone responded but finally figured it out!)
Continuing the thought though: I can see what you mean in the item you cite but it doth seem that Sam is doing a lot of "giving morning draughts" AND dinners -- as person who doesn't seem like a carefree spendthrift and who doesn't seem to be asking favors for the draughts, etc. in each case.
By the way, is there a convenient way to see if there are further comments?
San Diego Sarah • Link
"... is there a convenient way to see if there are further comments?"
When I log on each day, the first thing I do is go to RECENT ACTIVITY and I look at all the posts to previous dates.
If more than one person has posted to one date, only the last post will be highlighted, so I check all of them, just in case something interesting has been added.
There are lots of people reading now, all going at their own rate. It's not as tidy as the first time through.
But maybe your question was asking if there are further comments about Pepys paying for food?
Top right is the SEARCH box; typing "draughts" will bring up every mention for them during the whole 9-1/2 years in no particular order. You can then click through and read them all.
OR you can keep reading the diary every day and see if your question is answered in time. There are several things that only become clarified after several years. This will increase your enjoyment and avoid your reading SPOILERS, and will reduce your general confusion IMHO.
Another possibility is that, as you know, Pepys has been quietly "spying" on Sandwich's behalf ... maybe he submitted an expense account, as becoming familiar with more connected people increases his ability to discover information.
Whatever you decide to do, just keep reading ... the magic happens.
Jim Veihdeffer • Link
Thanks SDS. I have finally got through one entire year but I had to go through two libraries...and both copies have come due. The magic is certainly there but so are the libraries and their drone enforcement (just kidding), Wasn't aware of the "spying" aspect so thanks for that insight also.
Third Reading
San Diego Sarah • Link
Jim, if you're still reading along, 18 months later -- rather than spy, I should have used their word: Intelligencer.
Spies take chances and read other people's mail and break into offices and pretend to be people other than they are.
Pepys finds people who might know what's going on and buys them a drink. "Strange times," he says. "I heard xyz today. Do you know anything about that, or is it fake news?" blah blah blah. "Looks like you could use another glass of sack. I also heard ..." blah blah blah.
These are times without newspapers, investigative reporters, nightly news, etc. Just newsletters with opinions rather than facts, and rumors galore. Clergymen read out Parliament's pronouncements on Sundays.
Charles II will realize this isn't a good thing and authorize Williamson to send out a weekly newsletter with the equivalent of press releases from all over the world which people can subscribe to -- it's called the London Gazette, so you might still be familiar with it? But that's a couple of years away.
The ability to find out the facts in a timely manner is an important skill and task, or Pepys could invest valuable office time fighting the wrong fire. Being friendly with the people of influence around town takes an investment of time and a few bottles of wine, frequently applied. He needs all the friends he can get.