Monday 4 February 1660/61

Early up to Court with Sir W. Pen, where, at Mr. Coventry’s chamber, we met with all our fellow officers, and there after a hot debate about the business of paying off the Fleet, and how far we should join with the Commissioners of Parliament, which is now the great business of this month more to determine, and about which there is a great deal of difference between us, and then how far we should be assistants to them therein. That being done, he and I back again home, where I met with my father and mother going to my cozen Snow’s to Blackwall, and had promised to bring me and my wife along with them, which we could not do because we are to go to the Dolphin to-day to a dinner of Capt. Tayler’s. So at last I let my wife go with them, and I to the tavern, where Sir William Pen and the Comptroller and several others were, men and women; and we had a very great and merry dinner; and after dinner the Comptroller begun some sports, among others the naming of people round and afterwards demanding questions of them that they are forced to answer their names to, which do make very good sport. And here I took pleasure to take the forfeits of the ladies who would not do their duty by kissing of them; among others a pretty lady, who I found afterwards to be wife to Sir W. Batten’s son.

Home, and then with my wife to see Sir W. Batten, who could not be with us this day being ill, but we found him at cards, and here we sat late, talking with my Lady and others and Dr. Whistler, who I found good company and a very ingenious man. So home and to bed.

24 Annotations

First Reading

Eric Walla  •  Link

OK, let's get this straight ...

... first he kisses Sir W. Batten's daughter-in-law, then hot-foots it over to Sir Batten's house. Now was this prearranged, did he miss his company at the dinner or did Sam feel the need to gather more information about the pretty young thing?

Emilio  •  Link

"how far we should join with the Commissioners of Parliament . . ."

The L&M version of the second half of this sentence flows better than what's above; Wheatley's variations are in brackets:

". . . how far we should join with the Commissioners of Parliament (which is now the great business of this month [and] more to determine, and about which there is a great deal of difference between us and them ['us, and then' in Wheatley] how far we shall be assistant[s] to them) therein."

'Us and them' in particular is much more natural than Wheatley's phrasing.

Emilio  •  Link

"take the forfeits of the ladies who [c]ould not do their duty"

That's the L&M transcription, which gives a different idea of the ladies; perhaps not all of them were playing to lose . . .

Bradford  •  Link

"the naming of people round and afterwards demanding questions of them that they are forced to answer their names to, which do make very good sport."

Come, then, party animals: explain to us shy folks how to play this Fun Game.

daniel  •  Link

among others a pretty lady....

First he kisses (presumably) the wife of the son of Sir Batten as well as joining in other shinanigans then goes to Sir B's house to see whether the cost is clear. i suspect that we see more of this type of behavior with our Sam as time goes by.

Pauline  •  Link

"Come, then, party animals: explain to us shy folks how to play this Fun Game"

I guess we would give you a name; lets say Bottom. Then we would ask you questions for which you would say the name as the answer.

Where did you graduate in your class?
What are you scratching?
If it's all bunk, do you have a preference?

Other questions for Mr. Bottom?

daniel  •  Link

that is a very funny game-must try it some time! no wonder that the ladies were abashed.

J A Gioia  •  Link

the name game

i'm wondering if it would have included names notorious in gossipy london; members of the r.f. or courtiers. too risky perhaps?

Brad W  •  Link

Other questions for Mr. Bottom?

What was left of Charles I when they were through with him?

mary  •  Link

Pauline's guess at the nature of the name game

reminds me of the old, playground teaser:

Q. Adam and Eve and Pinchme
Went down to the river to bathe.
Adam and Eve were drowned.
Who do you think was saved?

A. (from the unwary) Pinchme.

Second Reading

Rich Reitz  •  Link

Is 'The Dolphin' the same as todays place? I have never been to England and just wondering..

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"the Nameing of people round, and afterwards demanding Questions of them that they are forced to answer their names to"

So transcribe L&M who further suggest the game was probably akin to 'Questions and Commands', which was common at the time. https://books.google.com/books?id…

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

1661. Feb. 4.
Senato, Secreta.
Dispacci, Inghilterra.
Venetian Archives. 277.

Francesco Giavarina, Venetian Resident in England, to the Doge and Senate.

The judges sentenced to death 17 of the rebels recently taken, and they have been executed these last days, their quarters being set on the city gates.
One or two repented their wickedness and confessed the king for their sovereign, but the others remained obstinate and were sorry for the miscarriage of their abominable designs, confessing that if they were not to die they would try again, and blaspheming Heaven for not helping them, denying absolutely any worldly authority, and so they have gone to the Devil.

Despite these punishments which should have checked those who hold such ridiculous beliefs it is discovered that some of them were devising fresh insurrections, so vigilance is redoubled and in searching suspect houses they have found arms, powder and other munitions of war which these ruffians kept hidden to use at a suitable moment.
With the seizure of these and the arrest of other persons this danger has been averted, and by close watch in the capital and elsewhere on the behaviour of the sectaries one may feel confident that any hope left them of realising their flimsy pretensions have altogether vanished.
As during these suspicions it was lawful for soldiers to enter the houses of fanatics to take away arms and anything else of military character, many persons not disaffected had their houses searched at the caprice of the soldiers, who took away arms intended for the king's service and many other things of value having no connection with war.
Complaints about this reached the king's ears and to prevent such abuses his Majesty at once issued a severe proclamation forbidding the search of houses under any pretext unless by a written order signed by a member of the privy council or a lord lieutenant and directed to the ordinary constables and other law officers, in accordance with the ancient constitutions of the realm. (fn. 1)

The queen [HENRIETTA MARIA] with the Princess Henrietta [ANNE], who has almost entirely recovered remains stranded at Portsmouth because of the wind, but it seemed to have turned yesterday and they hope to hear soon that she has crossed the water safely.

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

PART 2 of the letter from the Venetian Ambassador to the Court of St. James to the Doge:

Some time ago a dispute arose between the duke of Richmont and Sir Convalles, treasurer of the king's household, and some time after the duke struck the treasurer in the king's own chamber.
For this Richemont was immediately confined to his house by the king's order, where he remains and no one knows what the issue of the affair may be.
It is ugly because the deed was deliberate since the duke did not strike in the heat of the quarrel but many hours later, and it was against one in actual service in contempt of the king's apartment, which is sacrosanct.
[CHARLES STUART, DUKE OF RICHMOND = https://www.pepysdiary.com/encycl… ]

The king being in deep mourning for the princess of Orange and it being impossible to have everything ready for the coronation by the 16th February, they have decided to have it on the 23rd April, old style.
As that is the usual day for the king to go to Windsor to instal the knights of St. George, they have decided to anticipate that ceremony by some weeks, to have the place free and available for the coronation. So in a few days will take place two of the most splendid functions which are performed in this country, when there will be inexpressible pomp and a heavy expenditure.

The ambassadors of Spain, Denmark and Holland are working with the deputies appointed for them by the government, but in spite of frequent conferences they cannot arrive at any conclusion in their negotiations as everything proceeds here with incredible and most tiresome slowness.

Prince Maurice of Nassau is expected at Court soon in the capacity of ambassador extraordinary for the elector of Brandenburg, and for the Grand Duke of Tuscany the Marquis Salviati is coming with great pomp and a numerous suite, from what they say, bills having reached here already in the hands of the merchants Mico for many thousands of pounds sterling.
Old Galileo here finding that he has not yet been able to get anything in spite of the efforts of his agents with the Savio of the Exchequer for his debts and with the General of the Fleet for the ransom of his son, in spite of many promises from your Serenity, has again petitioned the king, showing how little his royal interposition has effected and asking for it again.
A secretary of the palace has been to see me to-day and urged me again in the king's name to write on the subject to your Excellencies and ask for the payment of some portion of this debt, after so many promises and delays and to direct the General, before he sails for the Levant, to ransom the slave Galileo.

I submit this to the Senate having enlarged to the messenger upon the good will of the state.

London, the 4th February, 1661.
[Italian.]

https://www.british-history.ac.uk…

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

As Galileo died in 1642, my guess is that Old Galileo is a code name for someone. No doubt, if I read more of their communications, more information will follow.

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

This Galileo question bothered me, so I read the March correspondence, and in a footnote there appeared:
"This must be Thomas Galilee, captain of the Relief. In a letter of 6–16 April Winchelsea says he has obtained the release of three slaves, but gives no names. Hist. MSS. Comm. Finch Papers Vol. i, page 110."
So we have no way of knowing if young Galilee made it out of Barbery slavery or not.

Third Reading

Keith Knight  •  Link

Apologies if this has been mentioned before, but are the assembled aware that 108 broadside ballads in the Pepys collection have been sung and set to music on https://www.100ballads.org ?

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

"The ambassadors of Spain, Denmark and Holland ..."

I'll say it before someone else points this out: Holland isn't a country; it's a state.
In the 17th century the country now known as the Netherlands was divided into two: The Protestant United Provinces of the Dutch Republic was self-governed by the States-General in The Hague, and the Catholic Spanish Netherlands, AKA Flanders had a governor in Brussels, but was ruled from Madrid.

Therefore, there was an Ambassador from the Dutch Republic, and an envoy or representative as was necessary from the Spanish Netherlands.

Holland is a province of the United Provinces of the Dutch Republic.

When Pepys says "Holland" he means the Dutch Republic.

If you're wondering why people could not take a straight route directly from England's South Coast to Paris by the shortest route, it has to do with Protestant/Catholic and Spain/France problems. Protestants often judged it safer to take longer routes.

I'm struggling with this as well -- it's so easy to think/write/say "Holland" or "the Netherlands" but in the long run these shortcuts cloud your understanding of the story.

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

"Francesco Giavarina, Venetian Resident in England, to the Doge and Senate. ... The king being in deep mourning for the princess of Orange and it being impossible to have everything ready for the coronation by the 16th February, they have decided to have it on the 23rd April, old style."

To clear up a confusing point here, Francesco Giavarina dates his letters NEW STYLE for the convenience of his masters in Venice -- but for our convenience you'll find we have often posted them under the Pepys' date in the Diary annotations. And Pepys is using the OLD STYLE calendar for the convenience of his masters at Whitehall.

I.E. Francesco Giavarina really wrote this letter 10 days ago. And he already knew the Coronation was delayed. Pepys apparently hasn't found that out yet, never mind John Pepys Jr. in Oxford who wants to cut classes in order to come to London to experience the fun and games.

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

Keith Knight's ballad site is great because it explains the background story to the ballad, when known.

However, if you want to hear some of the ballads, back in 2003 there was a CD named "The Musical World of Samuel Pepys," for sale on Amazon -- they not only had it but also gave music samplings from the first few selections!

Eric Walla cautioned that the musical quality is not of the highest caliber, so it probably sounds more like the tavern atmosphere of Pepys' time than do the professional CDs. One of his favorites is sung by the renown Alfred Deller. He also recommended "The King's Delight" from the “King's Noyse” (Harmonia Mundi) for more period ballads.
In 2003 Tower Records also stocked "The Musical World of Samuel Pepys" CD.
Good hunting.

徽柔  •  Link

Thanks for Keith Knight's information. The website is amazing. I once got an album called "A 17th century musical pub tour", but it actually contains "The skye boat song"...

Croakers Apprentice  •  Link

Dear San Diego Sarah - this site derives much of its magic from the collaboration of 17th Century and 21st Century minds, and so thank you for recruiting the Venetian Ambassador to our number!

“Complaints about this reached the king's ears and to prevent such abuses his Majesty at once issued a severe proclamation forbidding the search of houses under any pretext unless by a written order signed by a member of the privy council or a lord lieutenant and directed to the ordinary constables and other law officers, in accordance with the ancient constitutions of the realm“

It was nice in the quote that you offered from the Ambassador to see King Charles respecting that age-old foundation stone of British & American liberty - “an Englishman’s home is his castle.”

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