Sunday 11 August 1661
(Lord’s day). To our own church in the forenoon, and in the afternoon to Clerkenwell Church, only to see the two fayre Botelers; and I happened to be placed in the pew where they afterwards came to sit, but the pew by their coming being too full, I went out into the next, and there sat, and had my full view of them both, but I am out of conceit now with them, Colonel Dillon being come back from Ireland again, and do still court them, and comes to church with them, which makes me think they are not honest. Hence to Graye’s-Inn walks, and there staid a good while; where I met with Ned Pickering, who told me what a great match of hunting of a stagg the King had yesterday; and how the King tired all their horses, and come home with not above two or three able to keep pace with him. So to my father’s, and there supped, and so home.
19 Annotations
First Reading
A. De Araujo • Link
"I am out of conceit now with them"
conceit in this case meaning - to take a fancy to- British use only apparently.
Louis • Link
Unless there's a play called "The Two Fayre Botelers," it would seem that a footnote pertaining to yesterday's entry and "The merry Devill of Edmunton" has migrated here by mistake.
dirk • Link
Rev Josselin's diary for today:
"God good to us in manifold mercies, yet my little Betty . waywardly ill, the lord revive her, that she may live in his sight. god good in the Sabbath. yet I find a dead heart in myself and much deadness in persons"
vicente • Link
"only to see the two fayre Botelers" Boteler, another name for Butlers; just being upscale;[school boy way or a put down for one whom the nose is tilted to the stars] in noting the play of words, against a play that is no longer available for our scrutiny, the Butlers were oft called botelier[put down?] Dict: for Butler now ME Boteler, OFr Bouteillier [cupbearer]. .
Sam now longer entranced by the beauty.
strange, he moved for a better view not enough to get a whiff of perfume, or he did not want to be fluffed off.
Honest? just teasers?
conceit: meaning having the temerity of thinking that a pretty girl[one of the landed ones dah a lady] would give a glance or time of day to likes of the speaker.
Mary • Link
Colonel Dillon and the Botelers
Pepys's comments make it sound as if Dillon may have something of a poor reputation where women are concerned and the Butler sisters are therefore harming their own reputations by being seen with him.
These Butler (Boteler) girls were sisters of Mons. L'Impertinent
Stuart Mitchell • Link
RE: "I am out of conceit now with them"
More specifically than “to take a fancy to”, conceit here means “good opinion” as found in the following OED reference:
4 Personal opinion, judgement, or estimation, usually `in a neutral sense’
(J.), as in my conceit, in my opinion or conception of the case. Obs.
b of oneself, one’s own opinions, etc., with qualifying adjs. bad, good, etc.
Obs. See also SELF-CONCEIT, orig. `self-conceived opinion’. (Cf. 5 b.)
c in one’s own conceit: in one’s own private opinion, estimation, or
judgement: now coloured by sense 6.
5 Favourable opinion, esteem; = good conceit in 4. Now dial. exc. in out of
conceit with, dissatisfied with, no longer pleased with.
Peter • Link
Even now we could say that it's a bit conceited of Sam to think that he stands any chance with the two fair Butlers.
Rex Gordon • Link
"the King tired all their horses ..."
For Charles II's interest in hunting and prowess at riding (he had been well-taught by the Marquess of Newcastle), L&M refer readers to "Sabretache" (A.S. Barrow), "Monarchy and the Chase", pp 87-96. The King, L&M report, won several horseraces at Newmarket.
"only to see the fair Botelers ..."
This brings to my mind many a youthful Sunday morning I spent in St. Patrick's Church, Havre de Grace, Maryland USA, pining for the beautiful Catana Carcirieri in the next pew, wondering how to get her to notice me. Centuries pass and fashions and technology change, but human nature remains the same.
A. Hamilton • Link
"Unless there's a play called "The Two Fayre Botelers," it would seem that a footnote pertaining to yesterday's entry and "The merry Devill of Edmunton" has migrated here by mistake.”
It would appear that Louis’s conjecture is correct. A Google search turns up the following citation.
“The merry devil of Edmonton,” 1608
- By: Thomas Dekker; William Amos Abrams; Anthony Brewer; T. B.
- Publisher: Durham, N.C., Duke University Press, 1942.
Second Reading
Bill • Link
"but I am out of conceit now with them"
CONCEIT, Imagination, Fancy, Opinion.
To CONCEIT, to imagine, to fancy.
---An Universal Etymological English Dictionary. N. Bailey, 1675.
Sasha Clarkson • Link
Sam, at least for now, has lost interest in the Butler sisters, but later he goes to Gray's Inn Walks: THE place to see and be seen!
Bill • Link
"I am out of conceit now with them"
To be out of conceit with, n'aimer (ne se soucier) plus, être degouté de
To be out of conceit with himself, se deplaire
To put out of conceit with, degouter de
---A short dictionary English and French. G. Miège, 1684.
dégoûter - to disgust
john • Link
"the King tired all their horses ..."
Whilst Charles probably rode three-point (or even two-point), I imagine many of the party leaning back, slapping their horses' backs on every stride. That sort of pounding will tire out a horse very quickly.
Bill • Link
"with not above two or three able to keep pace with him"
It's hard to imagine anyone even thinking about outpacing Charles...
Terry Foreman • Link
"the King tired all their horses ..."
L&M suggest for Charles II's interest in hunting and his prowess at riding (he had been well taught by the Marquess of Newcastle) , we see 'Sabretache' (A.S. Barrow), Monarchy and the chase, pp. 87-96. He won several horeseraces at Newmarket.
Terry Foreman • Link
"I met with Ned Pickering, who told me what a great match of hunting of a stagg the King had yesterday; and how the King tired all their horses, and come home with not above two or three able to keep pace with him."
L&M: For Charles II's interest in hunting and his prowess in riding (he had been well taught by the Marquess of Newcastle), see 'Sabretache' (A. S. Barrow), Monarchy and the chase, pp. 87-96. He won several horse-races at Newmarket.
Third Reading
San Diego Sarah • Link
Angelo Correr and Michiel Morosini, Venetian Ambassadors extraordinary in England, were back at Whitehall today, and wrote a lengthy report to the Doge and Senate. I'm copying about half.
Being very readily admitted by the king to private audience we began by telling him how much the Senate appreciated the generous action of his ambassador at Constantinople in resisting the efforts of the Turks to use the ships of this nation.
The king seemed gratified and scarcely giving us time to conclude told us that he fully approved of the conduct of his ambassador, whom he had charged to persist on every occasion in preventing the aggrandisement of the Turks by means of the ships of Christian princes.
He added that the most serene republic had long been embarrassed by a grievous war, unaided save by God and her own courage. The miracle of her resistance was great, but even greater the shame of the princes of Christendom, who do not unite for her need. He had spoken to this effect in France, Spain and Holland during the time of his troubles, and he was equally ready now to do his utmost for so great a cause.
[REMEMBER THESE WORDS!]
The grievous war was the Ottoman–Venetian wars between the Ottoman Empire and the Republic of Venice 1396 - 1718. In 1661 they have been defending Crete since 1645. It’s called the Battle of Candia later in the Diary https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cre…
Later in the same audience, Charles walked back his enthusiasm for war with the Turks:
The king seemed pleased and repeated several times with energy that it was a shame the princes of Christendom should not endeavour to secure the republic and themselves for ever.
He would have done his utmost to show his good will and regretted his inability to do as he wished, saying frankly: 'You see Sirs, I am not yet well re-established, but I will surely do all I can.'
We could only respond to such confidence, expressed so frankly, which touched a point perhaps only too true by saying that his cause was so just and so supported by his prudence and valour that no doubt could be entertained of his entire and glorious establishment.
San Diego Sarah • Link
PART 2
The king thanked us and we then began to speak about the ships which had been searched by Algerian pirates and had discharged at Algiers, to the great injury of this mart, with the fraudulent consent of the captains.
We had no difficulty in making his Majesty understand the importance of this affair and its consequences, as he condemned the action and told us he had sent his fleet into the Mediterranean on purpose to make such arrangements as would prevent the repetition of such conduct, and on the return of the captains he said he would make the most severe example of their treachery, especially as he had recent news of other ships being similarly treated.
[Charles must have been aware of the problems with the rules governing freight, because Sandwich's first proposal when he contacted the local Governor was to rewrite the agreement.
https://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/… ]
With this opening we thought well to repeat our desire for the punishment of the captains and also that the parties injured might be indemnified.
The king assured us of his gracious intent and asked us to deliver our memorial to the secretary.
He repeated this twice and we acted at once on his advice. The Resident Giavarina is fully informed, he has the papers and by persevering he may reap the desired advantage.
When the opportunity offered we went to General Monck and tried to enlist his help. He received us amiably but rather as a soldier than a courtier, answering in general terms, indicating his small share in the king's resolves.
This we believe to be the case because his Majesty depends exclusively on the chancellor and because this man's influence depends solely on his past services although on their account he is much spoken of by many.
As he only speaks English we had to employ the interpreter, and we must confess that little or no benefit was derived from this visit, nor is it his custom to return any.
[The wily Albemarle fooled them! https://www.pepysdiary.com/encycl… ]
On taking leave of the king and thanking him for the honours received, especially the coaches, we told him we had made a faithful report of all to your Serenity, at which he seemed gratified and told us above all to mention his good intentions of acting against the enemy whenever he may be able to effect any great undertaking.
It is our duty to state that this prince, who is exceedingly courteous, generally extends his offers, we will not say beyond his intentions of performance, but he sometimes is not careful about embarking on certain affairs from which he is easily diverted by his councillors and particularly by the chancellor, who is devoted exclusively to internal affairs, though it is true that he told us frankly how matters were not yet very stable, and the state may reflect upon this caution, which is very remarkable.
San Diego Sarah • Link
PART 3
We could not pay our respects to the duchess of York because she was taking the waters at a great distance from this city (fn. 6);
FOOTNOTE: 6. Anne Hyde, Duchess if York, was at Tunbridge Wells. Rugge's Diary Brit Mus. Add. MSS. 10116, f. 223.
but on taking leave of his Highness [JAMES] we spoke of the king's goodwill to the cause, at which he expressed pleasure and said frankly that he would forward it as he was eager to be on board a fleet against the infidel; all his life had been passed in arms and he disliked private ease, and he could not go forth with greater satisfaction as High Admiral than on so great and just an occasion.
We expressed the hope that the opportunity might arise.
He then offered us the use of ships for our passage and sent us the necessary orders. We shall make use of them as soon as possible for living in England has become so dear as to be impossible for private purses, and we shall feel the effects for long, though we are glad to serve the state.
We shall try to take the most convenient road and having no occasion to stop anywhere we feel sure we shall be excused if no more letters are received from us.
We must add that we have profited greatly by the exertions of the Resident Giavarina, who has punctually performed the functions of his charge with universal praise and to the king's particular satisfaction.
In the act of departing we told his Majesty that Sig. Mocenigo would hold himself in readiness to act as ambassador in ordinary so soon as his Majesty should have acknowledged his acceptance to your Excellencies, whereupon the king said that he should be pleased to see him and would reply suitably to your Serenity.
London, the 11th August, 1661.
[Italian.]
The good Amb. Piero Mocenigo doesn't seem to have a bio. But his family was highly esteemed
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hou…
They also talked about activities in Transylvania being conducted by Gen. Raimondo Montecuccoli, which Count [PETER?] Strozzi would explain soon. Again the Strozzi family was clearly important, but no bio exists.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Str…
Raimondo Montecuccoli (born Feb. 21, 1609, Castle Montecuccolo, near Modena, Duchy of Modena — died Oct. 16, 1680, Linz, Austria) was a field marshal and military reformer, a master of the warfare based on fortifications and maneuver, who led Austrian armies to victory against enemies of the House of Habsburg for half a century.
https://www.britannica.com/biogra…
See the whole report at
'Venice: August 1661', in Calendar of State Papers Relating To English Affairs in the Archives of Venice, Volume 33, 1661-1664, ed. Allen B Hinds( London, 1932), British History Online https://www.british-history.ac.uk…