Wednesday 9 October 1661

This morning went out about my affairs, among others to put my Theorbo out to be mended, and then at noon home again, thinking to go with Sir Williams both to dinner by invitation to Sir W. Rider’s, but at home I found Mrs. Pierce, la belle, and Madam Clifford, with whom I was forced to stay, and made them the most welcome I could; and I was (God knows) very well pleased with their beautiful company, and after dinner took them to the Theatre, and shewed them “The Chances;” and so saw them both at home and back to the Fleece tavern, in Covent Garden, where Luellin and Blurton, and my old friend Frank Bagge, was to meet me, and there staid till late very merry. Frank Bagge tells me a story of Mrs. Pepys that lived with my Lady Harvy, Mr. Montagu’s sister, a good woman; that she had been very ill, and often asked for me; that she is in good condition, and that nobody could get her to make her will; but that she did still enquire for me, and that now she is well she desires to have a chamber at my house. Now I do not know whether this is a trick of Bagge’s, or a good will of hers to do something for me; but I will not trust her, but told him I should be glad to see her, and that I would be sure to do all that I could to provide a place for her. So by coach home late.

16 Annotations

First Reading

Bob T  •  Link

Mrs. Pepys

Sam may have stayed late and been merry, but he could still recognize a con game when he saw it. I wonder if his friend Bagge is in on the deal. He probably is because he's the one setting it up.

It's a sign that our Sammy is moving up because even old friends are trying to make money off him.

Bradford  •  Link

Can someone with L&M give details about "The Chances"? Impossible to Google with any efficiency.

vicente  •  Link

"...Now I do not know whether this is a trick of Bagge's,…” I’m glad that he doth not writ a Bagge of trick’s.???? He doth be frank.? Oh no!!

Paul Chapin  •  Link

Ruben, thanks for a great link. Fun to see an early notice of Joan Plowright.

Vicente, sssssss.

Mary  •  Link

"The Chances"

(per L&M) A comedy by John Fletcher, probably written about 1617 and published 1647. Don John, in this play, said to be one of Charles Hart's best roles. Pepys first noted seeing it on 27th February 1661.

JWB  •  Link

Bragge's bait...
"Mons. L'Impertinent…told me a ridiculous story how that last week he had caused a simple citizen to spend; 80l. in entertainments of him and some friends of his upon pretence of some service that he would do him in his suit after a widow”…Mar4 ‘59/60.

vicente  •  Link

There be no comment on that human trait the Con: Oh! those pearlies that fool the the ever hopeful human. { there is one....}
http://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/1…
Adspicere oportet quicquid possis perdere. Syrus, Maxims or keep ye 'and in ye pocket matey.
{you ought to watch whatever you can lose}

Pauline  •  Link

"...I do not know whether this is a trick..."
I'm unaware of such high jinx (the fakely stolen tankard, etc.) being part of today's government service up-and-comer's jostlings. I suppose it is possible that P. Wolfowitz was told that sticking a comb in his mouth would be a wise signal to a certain wealthy widow who had yet to write her will; but those of us outside those inner circles within inner circle no doubt miss (and misinterpret) a lot of the "fun" of it all.

Second Reading

GrannieAnnie  •  Link

Let's see: Half a day's work yesterday in the morning followed by entertainments (without Beth.) Today half a day's work followed by entertainments (mainly without Beth.) Idle hands are the devil's workshop, Sam! Better change your ways.

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"Now I do not know whether this is a trick of Bagge’s, or a good will of hers to do something for me; but I will not trust her"

L&M: Probably a slip for 'him'. This Mrs Pepys has not been identified. Nothing came of all this.

Third Reading

MartinVT  •  Link

Grannie Annie: We don't actually know whether Beth came along on today's frolic. Sam often doesn't mention her presence, but (a) these ladies came to the house for dinner, where Beth is presumed to be present, and (b) he promised Beth not to go to the theatre without her, so departing with these beauties while leaving Beth at home would not sit well. At all.

Also: "at home I found Mrs. Pierce, la belle, and Madam Clifford, with whom I was forced to stay". Forced, eh? I perceive a tongue firmly in cheek here.

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

GrannieAnnie: There was no money, so what work would you like Pepys to be doing?
A few weeks ago the Commissioners must have done everything to get a fleet ready for the trip to Lisbon. Now what?
No doubt the office is open, and what must be done is getting done. Pepys' clerk, Thomas Hater, had worked there for years, and could handle everything except the official signatures on the documents.
They hadn't invented deficit financing yet -- when the Exchaquor's closet was bare, there really was no money.
And you could only go so far on credit before your reputation was ruined, and in Pepys' day, reputation was everything.

Bryan M  •  Link

"They hadn't invented deficit financing yet"
Not quite correct. They just hadn't worked out to do it very well.
In 1672, Charles II defaulted on his debts to the goldsmith-bankers in what is known as the Great Stop of the Exchequer.
"Under Charles II the state finances were in such a grievous condition that the Crown found itself no longer able to honour its debts.
Throughout the 1660s, state expenditure had been running ahead of the taxation and revenue that Parliament was prepared to authorise. To bridge the gap, the Crown departments increasingly sold more and more debt to the leading London goldsmith bankers, secured against first call on the following two years' revenues. ...
The stop came suddenly and unexpectedly on Tuesday 2 January 1672."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sto…

Of course, SP's problem (and the Navy's) was that Charles blew a lot of the money raised on good times with the ladies.

MartinVT  •  Link

The stop of 1672

Very interesting history at Bryan's Wikipedia link. If you follow the various wranglings over this debt, it means that the debts being incurred during the 1660s are still today part of the general debt of the UK.

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

Since we are discussing things after the Diary, I guess all this isn't a spoiler:
"Of course, SP's problem (and the Navy's) was that Charles blew a lot of the money raised on good times with the ladies."

I won't argue that Lady Castlemaine walked off with more than she should have -- or that Nell Gwyn had a golden bed in the 1670's, which seems excessive (let's hope it was only gilded) -- or that Charles II's love of expensive clocks would have driven any mistress out of her mind, BUT in the 1660s (which we are concerned with) he also:
. undertood to pay off the considerable debt left by the Interregnum,
. fought an expensive (and unnecessary, to my mind) war which entailed rebuilting ships, castles and fortifications,
. rebuilt London's infrastructure after the fire,
. rebuilt England after the plague, and
. attempted to compensate the thousands of Royalists for their services during the Past Unpleasantness.

These were all expensive undertakings, and historians seem to agree that Parliament exercised their control over Charles by consistently under-funding him personally and the government. Their fear that he would build a domestic army made them parsimonious.

And left Charles open to influence from abroad.
As we know -- but Pepys doesn't appear to have cottoned onto yet -- Charles is trying to balance the budget at this moment by selling an expensive asset (Dunkirk) while being paid to take on others which are better placed for England's planned expansion (Tangier, Mumbei, and trading privileges in Brazil and the other Portuguese possessions). Remember, they considered the plantations of New England as being part of England. I don't think the concept of an empire was fully formed yet. (What the inhabitants of New England thought about that was, of course, totally different. They had gone there to escape.)

We love to present Charles as a womanizing fool, but during most of the Diary he was surrounded by wise councillors and was on the job in a responsible manner. I've read that he didn't need much sleep, and partied at night, and was at his desk by 7 a.m. every day -- like Pepys he did his business, and then had fun in the afternoon when he could.

By the Stop of 1672 those wise influences were long gone, and Charles was looking for the next get-rich-quick idea, and hoarding power by keeping the members of the CABAL guessing and in states of need-to-know.
I submit that Pepys' 1660 Charles II was a different king than the one who authorized The Stop -- not understanding the ramifications of what he did.

And they didn't have real deficit spending until the Bank of England under-wrote those debts -- which happened 40 years after the Diary.
Yes, Pepys could pay people with IOUs and Tally Sticks, but the Navy's reputation goes down the drain really fast if and when they couldn't make good on these obligations. Keep reading.

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