Friday 24 October 1662

After with great pleasure lying a great while talking and sporting in bed with my wife (for we have been for some years now, and at present more and more, a very happy couple, blessed be God), I got up and to my office, and having done there some business, I by water, and then walked to Deptford to discourse with Mr. Lowly and Davis about my late conceptions about keeping books of the distinct works done in the yards, against which I find no objection but their ignorance and unwillingness to do anything of pains and what is out of their ordinary dull road, but I like it well, and will proceed in it. So home and dined there with my wife upon a most excellent dish of tripes of my own directing, covered with mustard, as I have heretofore seen them done at my Lord Crew’s, of which I made a very great meal, and sent for a glass of wine for myself, and so to see Sir W. Pen, who continues bed-rid in great pain, and hence to the Treasury to Sir J. Minnes paying off of tickets, and at night home, and in my study (after seeing Sir W. Batten, who also continues ill) I fell to draw out my conceptions about books for the clerk that cheques in the yard to keep according to the distinct works there, which pleases me very well, and I am confident it will be of great use. At 9 at night home, and to supper, and to bed.

This noon came to see me and sat with me a little after dinner Mr. Pierce, the chyrurgeon, who tells me how ill things go at Court: that the King do show no countenance to any that belong to the Queen; nor, above all, to such English as she brought over with her, or hath here since, for fear they should tell her how he carries himself to Mrs. Palmer; —[Lady Castlemaine.]— insomuch that though he has a promise, and is sure of being made her chyrurgeon, he is at a loss what to do in it, whether to take it or no, since the King’s mind is so altered in favour to all her dependants, whom she is fain to let go back into Portugall (though she brought them from their friends against their wills with promise of preferment), without doing any thing for them. But he tells me that her own physician did tell him within these three days that the Queen do know how the King orders things, and how he carries himself to my Lady Castlemaine and others, as well as any body; but though she hath spirit enough, yet seeing that she do no good by taking notice of it, for the present she forbears it in policy; of which I am very glad. But I pray God keep us in peace; for this, with other things, do give great discontent to all people.

35 Annotations

First Reading

Bradford  •  Link

Mustard, tripes, and wine. And for afters?

Terry F  •  Link

Pepys introduces inventory control to the Royal Navy.

"I fell to draw out my conceptions about books for the clerk that cheques in the yard to keep according to the distinct works there, which pleases me very well, and I am confident it will be of great use."

A. De Araujo  •  Link

"a most excellent dish of tripes....covered with mustard....and sent for a glass of wine"
I must confess,my mouth is watering!!

Miss Ann  •  Link

What a way to start the day : "with great pleasure lying a great while talking and sporting in bed with my wife" - especially the sporting bit!

Alan Bedford  •  Link

"Mr. Pierce... tells me how ill things go at Court: that the King do show no countenance to any that belong to the Queen...for fear they should tell her how he carries himself to Mrs. Palmer..."

It may be good to be the King, but it's clearly a bad thing to be employed by the Queen. No access to the King, for reasons obvious to everyone at the palace. The intrigues are afoot.

Cumgranissalis  •  Link

Major changes to keep track of the ins and outs of monies and goods?
"...I fell to draw out my conceptions about books for the clerk that cheques in the yard to keep according to the distinct works there, which pleases me very well, and I am confident it will be of great use...."
It is not his money amd it be not part of his job description [just watching the discrepencies].

A case of "Thieves who steal from a private citizens spend their lives in bonds [not government issue] and chains; thieves who steal from public funds spend theirs in gold and purple.'
as Cato mentions in Praeda Militibus Dividenda, XI,3.
Fures privatorum in nervo atque in compedibus aetatem agunt; fures publici in auro atque in purpura.

Terry F  •  Link

Methinks Sam is ambivalent about the palace intrigues.

He BOTH hopes that Lady Castlemaine remain a very visible celebrity, AND is aware that the whole shebang could cause troubles, as are others, evidently.

Very titillating.

JWB  •  Link

"War without fire is like tripe without mustard: it is an insipid thing." Draco the Great, Penquin King. . Anatole France "Penquin Island".

Robert Gertz  •  Link

Don't Sam and Bess know that theirs is 'not a particularly happy marriage'?

Of course, to be fair we aren't getting Bess' opinion of the state of the union...

But then at the seven year stage...

Napoleon was ready to defy even his formidable mother to keep his Josephine and see her crowned the following year. (Despite a few affairs)

Franklin Roosevelt was basking in Eleanor's undiluted adoration while prepping for his first political race.

A loving Henry VIII, the Pope's fair-haired boy, and his beloved Catherine were quite hopeful their prayers would be answered for a healthy, bouncing boy...

And Tom Ewell was passing on a chance with his attractive upstairs summer neighbor...

***

Penn's gout...

Watch that oatmeal, whether or not your namesake's face is on the box, Sir Will. High in purines=uric acid=uric acid crystals.

Cutting back on the wine in imitation of your favorite neighbor wouldn't hurt either.

One site among many on the subject...http://www.chemsoc.org/…
***

Robert Gertz  •  Link

Nice to see that Sam appreciates Queen Catherine's 'spirit', however glad he may be that she combines it with policy and discretion.

Jesse  •  Link

"unwillingness to do anything of pains and what is out of their ordinary dull road"

Again, how little things change. I wouldn't be surprised if the reward for their "unwillingness" goes beyond saving themselves "pains". Often in a bureaucracy the superiors like those that be dull.

Diana Bonebrake  •  Link

Are we to assume that the Queen may have kept her own courtier to keep her from being lonely?
Did the ladies of the court -esp, the Queen-do that sort of thing back then or was there a double standard for women? We have a delightful and intelligent group of historians here. So what say you?

Pauline  •  Link

"...sporting in bed with my wife...blessed be God..."
Again, Sam and religion and whether his invocations are deeply pious or within-in-the-times knee jerks. Or a mellow mix of both?

Australian Susan  •  Link

I read Sam's invocation as an overflow of general well-being and an appreciation of how lucky he is: all in all, this is an upbeat and cheerful entry. Now, I wonder why?.........

Roger Arbor  •  Link

"... the Queen do know how the King orders things, and how he carries himself to my Lady Castlemaine..."

I predict it'll all end in tears. What an appalling man, a faithful wife as Queen and he prefers the 'Lady' whore. Catherine comes to us with no calumny attached, but as for Charles...

I am reminded of Jeannine's comment (16 June 2004): "What is true in all writing about her (good or bad)is that Catherine was pious, unquestionable faithful (which can not be said about ANY of his mistresses), simple in nature and totally unprepared for the morally depraved husband and court that he surrounded himself with and forced her to live with. She was basically imprisioned, ridiculed, neglected and alone." QED

Jeannine  •  Link

The role of a wife in the Court of Charles II.

Diana -no courtier for the Queen!
Although not quite yet in the Court of Charles II, Lord Rochester will come forth as a well known rake and rogue along with most of Charles II’s male companions. He will enter the court of Charles II and in many ways Charles will be a father figure and highly influential in shaping young Rochester’s values and concepts of male-female relationships. In his book, “the Profane Wit” Johnson gives a sharp summary of the view of women per Rochester, but this description is so highly applicable to many of the courtiers , and clearly similar to the view of Charles and his cronies. As Johnson explains (p 67)… “ Like his male contemporaries, young Rochester held to a sexual double standard. It was a man’s nature to crave variety. Virtuous young women who refused his advances were cruel and unkind. If a woman succumbed, however, she was a broken toy, fit only to be tossed aside; she had lost her virtue. A woman who played the man’s game of inconsistency was a slut and a whore, deserving his contempt. To marry such a woman was unthinkable – unless a man wanted to risk leaving his property to another man’s bastard. A husband was not expected to be faithful; his wife, of course, was.” So, the wives who were neglected and/or treated horribly by their husbands and perhaps happened by chance to return a smile of another man were whisked away to the country (or worse) while their husbands expected to remain free to pursue any opportunities that they chose to.
Two interesting side notes from the Court of Charles II (little spoilers but not about Sam):
1. Fraser will report that Charles II, “like many unfaithful husbands, managed to work up a fit of illogical jealousy against Edward Montagu [not Sandwich, another E.M], the Queen’s Master of the Horse, because he was thought to have squeezed her hand; Montagu was sacked.” Charles’ behavior during this time became irrational and out of character as seen by his snide comments to Monatgu as the friendship between the Master of the Horse and the Queen began. Clearly, Castlemaine may sleep around and he didn’t care, but a squeeze of Catherine’s hand……
2. When Lord Rochester, one of the most debauched libertine of Charles’ Merry Gang dies he will literally “reach” from the grave to ensure his wife’s fidelity to him. His will left the custody of his only legitimate son under the joint care of his wife and his mother (who his wife hated) and if Elizabeth remarried or carried on in any other way, she’d lose her son.

Jeannine  •  Link

The Queen's Nature

Diana, almost forgot.. also to be kept in mind. Catherine was actually a very innocent and devout Catholic. Her marriage vows were sacred to her, and although the Court of Charles II was of a highly debauched and libertine nature full of sex, alcohol and gambling she would go through a short period of "loosening up" her mode of dress and manner to conform to the genteel manner of the English, but never would she partake in non-marital sex, alcohol, gambling for stakes (although she loved to play cards). Her biographers all agree 100% on her virtues. The preface to the biography by Davidson states as follows:
"The court of the second Charles of England fluttered with dazzling and frivolous beauties. They obscured the softer light of other women who boasted only such trite and gentle virtues as womanliness, the fear of God, modesty, honesty and truth. Queen Catherine’s contemporaries detested her for her creed and her piety, for her uselessness as a political tool, for her bitter misfortune of childlessness, for the stumbling block that she innocently formed to their greed and ambition. They have left her portrait to posterity painted in malignant colours. They drew her a hideous, repulsive fool, too dull to be wicked, to narrow and prudish to have a heart. It is time that the blots should be sponged from the picture. Catherine lived in her husband’s court as Lot lived in Sodom. She did justly, and loved mercy, and walked humbly with her God in the midst of a seething corruption and iniquity only equalled, perhaps, in the history of Imperial Rome. She loved righteousness and her fellows,and, above all, the one man who won her heart on the day of her marriage, and kept it till the grave shut over her. She was one of the best and purest women who ever shared the throne of England. She had equal qualities of head and heart, and both were beyond the average. It has been a pleasant and wholesome labor to trace her blameless life, and to unfold the wrappings that have long hidden the character refined and ennobled by much unneccesary suffering."

Jeannine  •  Link

"I predict it’ll all end in tears" -Roger--Over time (and probably even by now) any tears will be in private and replaced by a stoicism that will remain througout her life in England.

Andrew Hamilton  •  Link

"their husbands expected to remain free to pursue any opportunities"

William Wycherly sends up the double standard of the time in "The Country Wife," in which Mr. Horner (!) encourages the rumor that he has been castrated so that he might freely enjoy the pleasures of London's married women without sullying their reputations.

http://www.bibliomania.com/0/6/27…

stolzi  •  Link

Sam
is having a wonderful day of self-esteem.

I'm good in bed
I'm good at keeping the books
I'm even good in the kitchen
I'm a kind soul who visits the sick

And ... people like me!

Bradford  •  Link

And compared to several other married couples close enough in this small town to be within sound of my voice if I yelled, I would hazard that, yes, as couples go, Elizabeth and Samuel are happy---or happier together than they would be apart.

Have come up with the perfect pudding for this meal: cherry soup. (No Lime Jell-O then.)

dirk  •  Link

Sam & Elizabeth

I have to agree with Bradford: I do think they were a fairly happy couple. The had their problems of course (being childless, Sam's pre-diary unfaithfulness, occasional quarrels), but who hasn't.

Pauline  •  Link

Sam & Elizabeth
I agree with Bradford and Dirk. Not only the essence of the relationship but also the idea of it--this is "my wife" and I chose well.

Joe  •  Link

Sam & Elizabeth and Charles & Catherine...

Yes, I'd agree that Sam and Elizabeth are the happier couple.

Second Reading

Terry Foreman  •  Link

Elizabeth's birthday was 23 October, (The diary has no mention of it.)
(L&M note)

Bridget Davis  •  Link

I find it odd, also, that Elizabeth's birthday wasn't mentioned. Didn't they celebrate them back then?

James Morgan  •  Link

I don't recall any of Sam's birthdays being mentioned.

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"I don't recall any of Sam's birthdays being mentioned."

Watch this space.

Doug Quixote  •  Link

"Double standard for the Queen"? Yes, but the double standard was actually between the monarch (male or female) and the consort. Henry V111 executed two wives and their supposed lovers, for it is and was high treason to have intercourse with the Queen and the Princess of Wales. But Elizabeth 1 had many lovers (not all documented) and Catherine the Great of Russia had even more and varied sexual activities . . .

Thus it was not a male/female double standard but a monarch/consort double standard.

I wonder what might have happened had Mary 11 (a joint sovereign with William 111) had had lovers?

Any views on that?

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"After with great pleasure lying a great while talking and sporting in bed with my wife (for we have been for some years now, and at present more and more, a very happy couple, blessed be God),"

L&M: One of the few passages in the diary which may be taken as referring to their separation in the early years of their marriage:
https://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/…

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"then walked to Deptford to discourse with Mr. Lowly and Davis about my late conceptions about keeping books of the distinct works done in the yards"

L&M: These were the call-books which Pepys introduced into the royal dockyards within the next six months, and of which he was very proud:
https://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/…

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"Mr. Pierce, the chyrurgeon, who tells me how ill things go at Court: that the King do show no countenance to any that belong to the Queen; nor, above all, to such English as she brought over with her, or hath here since, for fear they should tell her how he carries himself to Mrs. Palmer; —[Lady Castlemaine.]— insomuch that though he has a promise, and is sure of being made her chyrurgeon, he is at a loss what to do in it, whether to take it or no,"

L&M: He was surgeon to the Duke of York, and became surgeon to the King's Household in 1672, but he does not appear to have served the Queen.

Mary K  •  Link

A passing thought - could the mustard here refer to mustard greens? (Called collard greens in the USA I believe). It would perhaps be easier to cover a dish of tripes with mustard greens ( a kind of brassica) that with dried mustard.

Third Reading

Ruslan  •  Link

Dirk said (18 years ago):

> I have to agree with Bradford: I do think they were a fairly happy couple. The had their problems of course (being childless, Sam's pre-diary unfaithfulness, occasional quarrels), but who hasn't.

Is his unfaithfulness a documented thing? Or is that just supposition, as he and Elizabeth separated briefly pre-diary?

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