Sunday 23 December 1666

(Lord’s day). Up and alone to church, and meeting Nan Wright at the gate had opportunity to take two or three ‘baisers’, and so to church, where a vain fellow with a periwigg preached, Chaplain, as by his prayer appeared, to the Earl of Carlisle. Home, and there dined with us Betty Michell and her husband. After dinner to White Hall by coach, and took them with me. And in the way I would have taken ‘su main’ as I did the last time, but she did in a manner withhold it. So set them down at White Hall, and I to the Chapel to find Dr. Gibbons, and from him to the Harp and Ball to transcribe the treble which I would have him to set a bass to. But this took me so much time, and it growing night, I was fearful of missing a coach, and therefore took a coach and to rights to call Michell and his wife at their father Howlett’s, and so home, it being cold, and the ground all snow … [but the moon shining. In the way, I did prender su mano with some little violence; and so in every motion she seemed para hazer contra su will, but yet did hazer whatever I would. I did by degrees poner mi cosa en su mano nudo, and did hazerla tenerle et fregarle et tocar mi thigh; and so all the way home, and then did doner ella su gans para put on encore — she making many little endeavours para ôter su mano, but yielded still. We came home, and there she did seem a little ill, but I did take several opportunities afterwards para besar la, and so goodnight. – L&M] They gone I to my chamber, and with my brother and wife did number all my books in my closet, and took a list of their names, which pleases me mightily, and is a jobb I wanted much to have done. Then to supper and to bed.

26 Annotations

First Reading

Terry Foreman  •  Link

….

”“Lords day. Up, and alone to church; and meeting Nan Wright at the gate, had opportunity to take two or three besados, and so to church, - where a vain fellow with a periwig preached, Chaplin (as by his prayer appeared) to the Earl of Carlisle. Home, and there dined with us Betty Michell and her husband. After dinner, I to White-hall by coach, and took them with me; and in the way I would have taken su mano as I did last time, but she would in a manner withhold it.”
http://www.pepys.info/bits3.html#…

Terry Foreman  •  Link

“…. But this took me so much time, and it growing night, I was fearful of missing a coach; and therefore took a coach, and to rights to call Michell and his wife at their father Howletts; and so home, it being cold and the ground all snow, but the moon shining. In the way, I did prender su mano [ seize her hand ] with some little violence; and so in every motion she seemed para hazer contra su will, but yet did hazer whatever I did hazerla tenerle et fregarle et tocar mi thigh; and so all the way home, and did doner ella us gans para put on encore ­ she making many little endeavours para oter su mano, but yielded still. We came home, and there she did seem a little ill, but I did take several opportunities afterward para besar la [ to kiss her ], and so goodnight.”

http://www.pepys.info/bits3.html#…

Ruben  •  Link

Difficult to make sense here but this is what I feel as a possible translation:
"...in the way, I seized her hand with some little violence; and so in every motion she seemed to go reluctantly, but yet made whatever I wanted her to do by rubbing and touching my thigh; and so all the way home, and made her lust grow so that once again she made little endeavours with her hand, and yielded still...".

Ruben  •  Link

"with my brother and wife did number all my books in my closet, and took a list of their names, which pleases me mightily"
Books were very expensive, prestigious and lasted for more than a lifetime.
As his collection of books, ballads, etc. was growing, would Pepys give a market value to his books when making his accounts?

Mary  •  Link

a bit more to these dot-dot-dots...

....did hazer whatever I would. I did by degrees poner mi cosa en su mano nudo and did hazerla tenerle and fregarle et tocar mi thigh.....

Pepys is, in the terms of the 1930s, NSIT (not safe in taxis). What a grubby little picture of himself he's presenting this month.

andy  •  Link

I can just see the BBC costume version of the Life of Sam, with his wandering hands... Merry Christmas to all fellow Pepsyians!

martinb  •  Link

The cod Spanish and French is at times unclear here, but so is the choreography. Where exactly is the husband while this is going on? Are we to imagine him sitting quietly beside them in the coach? Later, does he stand politely to one side as Pepys takes his "several opportunities" to kiss Betty?

Don McCahill  •  Link

> What a grubby little picture of himself he’s presenting this month.

Is he? I wonder if perhaps his attitude about sex and women, as repulsive to us today, might have been the norm for young rich men of that time. He may only be unique in that he writes it down in his diary, while others may not have.

We have to be careful not to judge a 17th century man with a 21st century moral code.

Australian Susan  •  Link

It is half past one on Christmas morning here, so a Merry Christmas to one and all!

And, yes, alas, what Sam does is normal behaviour for men of his time and class.

And,also, we do have to remember that time and again nowadays, men are confronted about behaviour which women consider to be sexual harassment and they, genuinely, don;t think they are doing any harm. Grrr!

Mary  •  Link

Fairly grubby, I think.

Mitchell himself could indeed have been in the coach. It is dark night, there will have been no light within the coach and precious little (if any) anywhere in the street. The weather is cold and snowy, so the chances are that the passengers are wearing long, winter cloaks whose folds might be used to conceal the assault. No wonder poor Betty looked ill by the time that the journey ended;the friend who was so playful and light-hearted in her early youth has turned into a calculating predator.

Uncle Wight, anyone? We didn't have much to say in favour of his impropriety towards Elizabeth.

Ruben  •  Link

"Uncle Wight, anyone? We didn’t have much to say in favour of his impropriety towards Elizabeth."

Samuel did not like his uncle's proposition, but it was an open, civilized proposition, according to those times. Samuel knew the mores of his century and behaved accordingly.
He and Elizabeth continued to be in social contact with the uncle and his wife, that was also in the knowing.
The reason for not accepting the proposition was not the impropriety of it but that Samuel, unknown to his uncle, was earning enough not to need his uncle's favours. When things were sorted out, everyone continued his life as nothing happened, because it probably was not that exceptional.

CGS  •  Link

> What a grubby little picture of himself he’s presenting this month.

Is he? <
He be just the run of the mill homo sapiens/erectus.

The human character be like the moon, that be
rarely seen except on a cloudless night, and then only sometimes a slither at the best of times, never to see the other side, exception is when you send a analyst to see the other side.
To see the whole human psyche, one has to read their diary or have them on a couch.
Nobody really knows another human in toto, all 'umans have appended a facade worthy of the audience
of their peers.

In this Diary, we get slithers of the "morality" of the times from the puritanical to the Epicurean.
Mankind seeks pleasures [period], it matters not that they be painful to the recipient of the seeker,or even to seeker themself, pain being felt minutes,hours, days or even months later, only way the Idiot will desist is when they fail to get the pleasure but instead get instant pain.

Fear, ala ten commandments , thou shalt not steal anything ,steal wife, life, brain, limb, food , clothing, house,or lie or cheat or give pain to others [and etc] to make thee top dog, for the greater fear of Hell, heaven forbid for a logical reason.
For Most, hell or punishment no longer exists.
It matters not that by following that code, one can have a pleasurable life, without fear.

f

Robert Gertz  •  Link

So when your representative tells you we don't need harassment laws with teeth in them...I'd inquire into what that Congressman's or MP's personal rep is. Fear of exposure and punishment...That's what works, at least until attitudes change...And for some,it's the only thing that ever works.

It does seem hard to believe that Mitchell didn't have a clue as to what was going on...But possibly in a dark carriage with an experienced lecher like our hero and a young wife anxious to avoid a scene... On the other hand, I suppose were Mitchell to have offered to knock our hero's teeth out, he would have faced severe punishment.

As for excusing Sam on the grounds of "man of his era"...Hmmn...Nah...He knows what's wrong about his behavior and wouldn't dare with a woman of any standing with protection. This boils down to a class and power issue. Betty has no protection. Mitchell would face punishment if he were to block Sam and Sam took it amiss. Sam might at worst suffer some disapproval...Possibly he might risk his position if Charles were to take such things among subordinates badly, say as an embarassment... But unless Mitchell kills him, he faces little chance of real punishment. He does it not because he doesn't know better but because he can...And knows he can get away with it. Judge him...No, our era has less excuse than his...Let him off with that excuse...No.

Lawrence  •  Link

RG you have hit the nail on the head, Sam is the greedy rich boy in the sweet shop, and is getting more greedy, and doesn't care! that they would much rather he didn't! if any of this was to befall his Wife, he goes half mad with is old sickness! so in a nut shell he knows it's un-exceptable. (period!)

language hat  •  Link

"We have to be careful not to judge a 17th century man with a 21st century moral code."

No, I agree with Robert Gertz, this is timeless sleazy alpha-male behavior. It's not "a 21st century moral code," for heaven's sake, it's in Sam's own Bible, and he knows himself he's not acting well. Just because someone's being a jerk in the past doesn't mean they get a free pass.

Oh, and a merry Christmas to those that celebrate it!

Fern  •  Link

Order of precedence for getting into a carriage:
The lady is handed in first. Mitchell defers to Pepys who climbs in and sits beside Betty. Mitchell has no choice but to sit opposite them in the near-pitch dark.

Robert Gertz  •  Link

Again, our era stands and will stand up less well in many ways. But Sam knows what he's doing...There was a time when he even worried about it with a woman like Diana Crisp who was a willing partner. Now...

Fred Wilson  •  Link

Regarding "he ... wouldn’t dare with a woman of any standing with protection." I noted the following with Penn's daughter:

Nov 28, 1966: "Pegg with me in my closet a good while, and did suffer me ‘a la baiser mouche et toucher ses cosas’ upon her breast, wherein I had great pleasure"

Second Reading

Terry Foreman  •  Link

The dark in the coach at night

is much enhanced by the lurching and noises of the coach itself and the sounds of the horses and coachman, and the sudden sounds the traffic of passing coaches and cries in the narrow streets make, and the cold and moving shadows on the coach. All in the coach are subject to a sensory overload, the perfect cover for wandering,, violent fingers.

Nate Lockwood  •  Link

Thanks, Mary: "Mitchell himself could indeed have been in the coach. It is dark night, there will have been no light within the coach and precious little (if any) anywhere in the street. The weather is cold and snowy, so the chances are that the passengers are wearing long, winter cloaks whose folds might be used to conceal the assault. "

The coach also had curtains which surely would have been closed as it was cold and they had no need to show off, that is, to be seen. It would have been the kind of darkness we very seldom see in this age of light pollution.

James Morgan  •  Link

In the wake of Harvey Weinstein, Donald Trump and the me-too movement just in the last few years, it doesn't seem like our modern mores are very different from those of Pepys times. A few days ago the diary mentioned Parliament reprimanding an MP who raped the daughter of his Parliamentary opponent. So exposure had some limited effect then as now.

Louise Hudson  •  Link

How times have changed! (Thank the powers that be). Can any woman on this list imagine being in such a position with a man, especially another woman’s husband, with one’s own husband sitting right there? In my whole long life I have never had a man even attempt to take such liberties with me or anyone else. Yuck!

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

Seems to me Pepys' behavior has become outright reckless in the last year. I agree his carriage behavior is outrageous; but other capers were with neighbors and with his own staff. Perhaps the Fire and the Plague and fear of invasion has dulled his sense of propriety. Being in the proximity of death does funny things to the libido. Still ... Yuck indeed.

Timo  •  Link

In his defence, Sam does seem to have thrown in the towel on his sexless marriage. It seems like an age since he did anything more intimate with his wife than ‘lie long in bed catting’. Men in their prime have needs and he is clearly trying to get whatever he can, wherever he can. He does seem to be off the leash but I suppose divorce in those times was not really an option.

Happy Christmas to all the annotators who are keeping this second round alive. Especially Sarah for her excellent insights.

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