Monday 29 April 1667

Up, being visited very early by Creed newly come from Hinchingbrooke, who went thither without my knowledge, and I believe only to save his being taxed by the Poll Bill. I did give him no very good countenance nor welcome, but took occasion to go forth and walked (he with me) to St. Dunstan’s, and thence I to Sir W. Coventry’s, where a good while with him, and I think he pretty kind, but that the nature of our present condition affords not matter for either of us to be pleased with any thing. We discoursed of Carcasse, whose Lord, he tells me, do make complaints that his clerk should be singled out, and my Lord Berkeley do take his part. So he advises we would sum up all we have against him and lay it before the Duke of York; he condemned my Lord Bruncker. Thence to Sir G. Carteret, and there talked a little while about office business, and thence by coach home, in several places paying my debts in order to my evening my accounts this month, and thence by and by to White Hall again to Sir G. Carteret to dinner, where very good company and discourse, and I think it my part to keep in there now more than ordinary because of the probability of my Lord’s coming soon home. Our Commissioners for the treaty set out this morning betimes down the river. Here I hear that the Duke of Cambridge, the Duke of York’s son, is very sick; and my Lord Treasurer very bad of the stone, and hath been so some days. After dinner Sir G. Carteret and I alone in his closet an hour or more talking of my Lord Sandwich’s coming home, which, the peace being likely to be made here, he expects, both for my Lord’s sake and his own (whose interest he wants) it will be best for him to be at home, where he will be well received by the King; he is sure of his service well accepted, though the business of Spain do fall by this peace. He tells me my Lord Arlington hath done like a gentleman by him in all things. He says, if my Lord [Sandwich] were here, he were the fittest man to be Lord Treasurer of any man in England; and he thinks it might be compassed; for he confesses that the King’s matters do suffer through the inability of this man, who is likely to die, and he will propound him to the King. It will remove him from his place at sea, and the King will have a good place to bestow. He says to me, that he could wish, when my Lord comes, that he would think fit to forbear playing, as a thing below him, and which will lessen him, as it do my Lord St. Albans, in the King’s esteem: and as a great secret tells me that he hath made a match for my Lord Hinchingbroke to a daughter of my Lord Burlington’s, where there is a great alliance, 10,000l. portion; a civil family, and relation to my Lord Chancellor, whose son hath married one of the daughters; and that my Lord Chancellor do take it with very great kindness, so that he do hold himself obliged by it. My Lord Sandwich hath referred it to my Lord Crew, Sir G. Carteret, and Mr. Montagu, to end it. My Lord Hinchingbroke and the lady know nothing yet of it. It will, I think, be very happy. Very glad of this discourse, I away mightily pleased with the confidence I have in this family, and so away, took up my wife, who was at her mother’s, and so home, where I settled to my chamber about my accounts, both Tangier and private, and up at it till twelve at night, with good success, when news is brought me that there is a great fire in Southwarke: so we up to the leads, and then I and the boy down to the end of our lane, and there saw it, it seeming pretty great, but nothing to the fire of London, that it made me think little of it. We could at that distance see an engine play — that is, the water go out, it being moonlight. By and by, it begun to slacken, and then I home and to bed.

21 Annotations

First Reading

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"We discoursed of Carcasse, whose Lord, he tells me, do make complaints that his clerk should be singled out"

This is Sir William Brouncker again, whose clerk James Carkasse is, but fortunately, The Duke of York sides with Pepys.

***

"I hear that the Duke of Cambridge, the Duke of York’s son, is very sick"

L&M note he will die on 20 June at age four. http://www.pepysdiary.com/encyclo…

***

"my Lord Treasurer very bad of the stone, and hath been so some days"

Thomas Wriothesley (4th Earl of Southampton) will die on 16 May at age 59. http://www.pepysdiary.com/encyclo…

Tony Eldridge  •  Link

My Lord Hinchingbroke and the lady know nothing yet of it.
"Marriage, Edward? Just business my lad, just business."

Robert Gertz  •  Link

"My Lord Hinchingbroke and the lady know nothing yet of it. It will, I think, be very happy."

"Debt, with Prestige, do you take Money, with Old Established Family to be your lawful wedded bride?"

Robert Gertz  •  Link

"...when my Lord comes, that he would think fit to forbear playing, as a thing below him, and which will lessen him, as it do my Lord St. Albans, in the King’s esteem..."

No more rounds of "I Gave My Love A Cherry" on guitar? Aw...

Yes, Lord knows one wouldn't want to fall in Charlie's esteem...It inhabits such a lofty plane, requires such a hign moral tone.

"Speaking of which, Pepys..."

"Sir George?"

"About those songs of yours...The ones you keep singing for us...All the time?"

Andrew Hamilton  •  Link

"Radix malorum est cupiditas" applies especially to the tale of Viscount Brouncker, Mr. Carcasse, Sam, Sir William Warren and, perhaps, Sir William Coventry.

It even throws a sidelight on Sam's distrust of Sir William Penn.

As I read it, Brouncker is very friendly with Sam on becoming a naval commissioner, but soon figures out how to get the graft, promotes his associate Mr. Carcasse as a rival clerk, and woos timber merchant Sir William Warren away from Sam presumably by offering more favorable terms and/or giving the impression that, with his royal connections and much higher establishment rank, he will be more influential in helping Warren get contracts.

Carcasse appears to have started his own troublesome line of graft in handling tickets.

These developments upset the way business was done at the office and a settled flow of funds to Sam and, perhaps -- it is only a guess -- to Sir William Coventry. Their appeal to the Duke of York to fire Carcasse trumps Brouncker's more indirect influence at court.

As for the application of the Pardoner's saw to the relationship between Sir William Penn and Sam, I believe Sam's distrust dates back to a disagreement over who should manage a contract and get the associated thank-you payments.

Terry Foreman  •  Link

Andrew Hamilton, thanks for that very good summary of things at the Navy Office.

Nix  •  Link

"We discoursed of Carcasse" --

Sounds like something out of James Joyce:
We discoursed of Carcasse
We discassed of Carcourse
We discarsed of Courcasse
etc.
etc.

Second Reading

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"he [Sir G. Carteret] is sure of his [Sandwich's] service well accepted, though the business of Spain do fall by this peace."

L&M observe the French attack on the Spanish-Netherlands, however, gave Sandwich's mission a new importance . He concluded a new trade treaty with Spain on 3 May, mediated in thew peace between Spain and Portugal ib January 1668, and did not return to England until September 1668.

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"He says to me, that he could wish, when my Lord comes, that he would think fit to forbear playing, as a thing below him, and which will lessen him, as it do my Lord St. Albans"

L&M note St Albans is said to have lost vast sums at the gaming-table, In 1683 Evelyn speaks of him (iv. 338) as old and blind but still playing -- 'having one that sets by him to name the spot in the Chards'.

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"my Lord Treasurer very bad of the stone, and hath been so some days."

L&M: Southampton died on 26 May at the age of 39.

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"Sir G. Carteret....tells me that he hath made a match for my Lord Hinchingbroke to a daughter of my Lord Burlington’s, where there is a great alliance, 10,000l. portion; a civil family, and relation to my Lord Chancellor, whose son hath married one of the daughters."

L&M: Laurence Hyde, second son of Clarendon and later Earl of Rochester, had married Lady Henrietta Boyle, fifth daughter of the 1st Earl of Burlington, in 1665. Viscount Hinchingbrooke married Lady Anne Boyle, Burlington's fourth daughter, in January 1668.

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"My Lord Sandwich hath referred it to my Lord Crew, Sir G. Carteret, and Mr. Montagu"

L&M: William Mountagu, Sandwich's cousin and legal adviser. Henry Moore was also to be consulted Sandwich's note of his committing the negotiations to these advisers (c. March 1667) is in Sandwich MSS, Journals, iii. 694. The settlement was a poor bargain: see https://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/…
For Carteret's letters to Sandwich urging the match, see Harris, ii. 178.

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"My Lord Sandwich hath referred it to my Lord Crew, Sir G. Carteret, and Mr. Montagu"

L&M: William Mountagu, Sandwich's cousin and legal adviser. Henry Moore was also to be consulted Sandwich's note of his committing the negotiations to these advisers (c. March 1667) is in Sandwich MSS, Journals, iii. 694. The settlement was a poor bargain: see https://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/…
For Carteret's letters to Sandwich urging the match, see Harris, ii. 178.

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"news is brought me that there is a great fire in Southwarke"

L&M: Near the Spur Inn; over 40 families lost their homes/ I was said to be started deliberately by three Frenchmen. Accounts in N & Q ., 1 February 1851, p. 99; CSPD 16676, pp. 337, 338.

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

"L&M: Southampton died on 26 May at the age of 39."

Thomas Wriothesley, 4th Earl of Southampton, born 1607 — died May 16, 1667, so that makes him 59 going on 60.

Scube  •  Link

What does the reference to an "engine play" mean?

James Morgan  •  Link

It is interesting that the news of Sandwich's son marriage negotiations follows so quickly after Pepys hearing of the financial disarray of his family on April 27th, and Pepys turning a deaf ear to suggestion that he might lend 1900l.
"This afternoon I spent some time walking with Mr. Moore, in the garden, among other things discoursing of my Lord Sandwich’s family, which he tells me is in a very bad condition, for want of money and management, my Lord’s charging them with bills, and nobody, nor any thing provided to answer them. He did discourse of his hopes of being supplied with 1900l. against a present bill from me, but I took no notice of it, nor will do it. It seems Mr. Sheply doubts his accounts are ill kept, and every thing else in the family out of order, which I am grieved to hear of."

Scube  •  Link

Thanks Terry. Very interesting.

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