L&M: "Robert, styled Viscount Bodmin from 1679, whose marriage to Sara Bodville drew Pepys' attention, died before his father in 1682. He had been appointed ambassador to Denmark in 1681."
m. (before 1658) Sarah Bodvile (bur 20 September, 1720, dau of John Bodvile of Bodvile Castle)
Good try, Terry -- and almost the same name, but you've posted about the mother and not possibly / probably her first daughter.
From the same website, giving us a few daughters to chose from:
Children of Laetitia Isabella Smythe and John Robartes, Earl Radnor: 1. Lady Letitia Isabella Robartes 2. Lady Olympia Robartes d. 24 Feb 1733 3. Hon. Francis Robartes b. 1650, d. 7 Jul 1718 4. Hon. Mary Robartes b. 18 Jun 1661, d. 1670 5. Hon. Warwick Robartes b. 27 Jul 1667 6. Hon. Essex Robartes b. 4 Apr 1669
Grief involves feelings of deep loneliness, a word that only came into being from around 1800, and then in relation to a religious state of ‘desolation’, akin to that experienced by Jesus in the wilderness. Widows' and widowers' desolation would be recognized as ‘oneliness’, a term that was similar to solitude, but had nothing to do with the modern emotion of loneliness. How could it? When God was there, one was never alone.
I'm glad Pepys had Elizabeth. I have serious doubts about his relationship with God. I'm glad John Evelyn had Mary Browne, plus I think he did have the relationship with God described above -- something few of us fully appreciate today. We know all about loneliness though.
The Rose Tavern on King Street, close to Westminster Hall -- Pepys' and Doll Lane's haunt, which must have been very 'discrete' considering what they got up to there. Plus, on their first visit, Pepys was a little concerned by the people of quality who saw him leave (albeit alone, so they had nothing on him).
"Then out to the ‘Change to speak with Captain [Cocke], who tells me my silver plates are ready for me, and shall be sent me speedily; and proposes another proposition of serving us with a thousand tons of hemp, and tells me it shall bring me 500l., if the bargain go forward, which is a good word."
L&M: Cocke is promising hemp futures WAY beyond his ability to deliver, and refers us to 27 July, 1666 http://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/1… etc.
L&M: Cocke was asking an inflated price of £57 per ton for this, making the whole deal worth £57,000.
Thanks, Buffalo Gal ... I was interested to see that the second one giving thanks for William III's intervention called for a blessing on King George, so more poking around to find the date of its adoption is called for. I suppose it would be "bad form" for William to introduce this idea in his lifetime.
"It should be noted that at this time, it was probably the Pope who was being burned in effigy, not Guy Fawkes on the bonfires."
According to this article, pope-burning went out during the 1640's, and wasn't revived until an apprentice riot in the 1670's. So when Pepys talks about bonfires, that is what he's seeing. No guys. No popes.
The Bonfire Night celebration on November 5 was fireworks (probably community-based, as now) and local bonfires (probably raked up autumn leaves, plus whatever needed to be burned from their homes and shops). Before Cromwell they often burned the pope in effigy.
In the 1670's a pamphlet, The Burning of the Whore of Babylon, gives us a description of the first spontaneous pope-burning since the 1640's that was held during the celebrations commemorating the discovery of the Gunpowder Plot on November 5, 1673. The author reports the apprentices decided "to make a new addition (to a parade) with a large effigy of the whore of Babylon dressed up with all the popish ornaments."
The author described how the Pope "was carried not in a chair, but as a traytor's head upon the Bridge, fixed upon a pole in procession all about the Poultrey market place, attended with near an hundred torches, and more than a thousand people." http://www.moyak.com/papers/popis…
All this nostalgia about "Guy Fawkes" Night is very previous. It was just bonfires (probably raking up the autumn leaves, and adding whatever needed to be burned from their homes and shops). Before Cromwell they burned the pope in effigy.
In the 1670's a pamphlet, The Burning of the Whore of Babylon, gives us a description of the first spontaneous pope-burning since the 1640's that was held during the celebrations commemorating the discovery of the Gunpowder Plot on November 5, 1673. The author reports the apprentices decided "to make a new addition (to a parade) with a large effigy of the whore of Babylon dressed up with all the popish ornaments."
The author described how the Pope "was carried not in a chair, but as a traytor's head upon the Bridge, fixed upon a pole in procession all about the Poultrey market place, attended with near an hundred torches, and more than a thousand people." http://www.moyak.com/papers/popis…
"The fall of rents was a common complaint of landlords at this time."
Both Ormonde and Peterborough complaining of this today ... one in Ireland, and who knows where Peterborough's lands were.
Yesterday we found out that last March the Middlesex JP's got a nasty note from the Treasurer Earl of Southampton for not being diligent enough collecting the excise from a baker in Twickenham.
Why? My guess is that the plague had affected a lot of areas, and the dry summer probably means there was a bad harvest. The man in Twickenham would have been affected by both the impress of able-bodied men (which was before the harvest) and the loss of business due to the plague.
Or were people simply resisting paying for the wealthy merchants' war?
The elections around this time show local gentlemen being returned, with the cry of "No more courtiers". The country party versus the court party was shaping up.
Since we are discussing the alternative narratives about the Great Fire, you might be interested to read a fun novel about the adventures of 1666 by a true historian, J.D. Davies, who likes to also explore his knowledge creatively.
He published DEATH'S BRIGHT ANGEL as part of the 350th anniversary of these events. The last 40 pages are devoted to evidence that was withheld at the time, or narratives from people published decades later and ignored by historians who like the contemporary explanation that it was an accident.
There really is room for doubt here.
Old Street Historical Fiction ISBN 978-1-910400-46-3
St. Katharine Cree Church, built in 1631 (tower from 1504). Although the church was damaged during the Great Fire of London, enough of the structure remained to provide a temporary 'soup kitchen' to the local workers who were rebuilding the city.
'... and there began to read “Potter’s Discourse upon 666,” which pleases me mightily, ...'
This is funny. Obviously I haven't read Potter’s Discourse, but we just had Halloween, and tomorrow is the Gunpowder Plot holiday. It sounds like Pepys might as well be reading "The Shining" or watching a horror movie, and loving it. I hope it helps him sleep well tonight.
Charles, 2nd Earl of Norwich's and Gen. George, Lord Goring's sister, Lady Catherine Goring married Edward Scott of Scot's Hall and had several children, whose paternity her husband refused to acknowledge, on the grounds of her notorious infidelity (Prince Rupert was said to be her lover).
Mr. Scott belatedly acknowledged Lady Catherine Goring Scott's son, Thomas Scott, as his lawful son.
In 1663 this Thomas Scott married Caroline Carteret, daughter of our Sir George Carteret.
The House of Commons are discussing the sale of Goring House.
Before the Civil Wars it was the home of George Goring, 1st Earl of Norwich. As good Royalists, the Earl and his first son, Gen. George, Lord Goring, both ended up on the continent. Gen. George become a Catholic convert and died penniless in Madrid in 1657, aged 49. He was buried in the English Jesuit chapel of St. George in Madrid.
The Earl of Norwich died in January 1663 in Brentwood, so apparently he didn't regain title to the house at the Restoration. His second and surviving son, Charles became the 2nd Earl of Norwich, but had no children.
In 1665 Henry Bennet became the Baron of Arlington and coincidentally took up residence at Goring House, so my guess is that Charles II kept the title to the house and rewarded Bennet for his years of service with it.
If that's the case, Arlington will pay Charles II a few thousand ... fundraising any way they can.
This entry by Pepys is the first evidence that English trumpeters were beginning to play composed music, although no trumpet parts in English music have survived until after the late 1680s.
Before now, the trumpet was used as a fanfare instrument, used in armies and at courts to invest ceremonial with grandeur. Trumpeters usually played in bands, supported by timpani, using a semi-improvised repertory based on one or two chords.
The first experiments with using trumpets in composed music were made in German church music around 1620, although it seems that trumpets were not used in instrumental music until after 1650.
The earliest dated sonata for trumpets and strings is by Vincenzo Albrici and was written between 1652 and 1654 when he was director of the Italian musicians at the Swedish court.
Albrici is important for the history of English trumpet music because he worked in London in the 1660s. In 1664 James, Duke of York asked him to press trumpeters to work at sea, so apparently they were used for audible communications during the Second Anglo-Dutch war (or at least James wanted to try that).
Comments
Second Reading
About Sara Robartes (b. Bodvile)
San Diego Sarah • Link
L&M: "Robert, styled Viscount Bodmin from 1679, whose marriage to Sara Bodville drew Pepys' attention, died before his father in 1682. He had been appointed ambassador to Denmark in 1681."
m. (before 1658) Sarah Bodvile (bur 20 September, 1720, dau of John Bodvile of Bodvile Castle)
Robert Robartes, Viscount Bodmin was MP for Bossiney, 1661-1673. https://www.historyofparliamenton…
About Laetitia Isabella Robartes
San Diego Sarah • Link
Good try, Terry -- and almost the same name, but you've posted about the mother and not possibly / probably her first daughter.
From the same website, giving us a few daughters to chose from:
Children of Laetitia Isabella Smythe and John Robartes, Earl Radnor:
1. Lady Letitia Isabella Robartes
2. Lady Olympia Robartes d. 24 Feb 1733
3. Hon. Francis Robartes b. 1650, d. 7 Jul 1718
4. Hon. Mary Robartes b. 18 Jun 1661, d. 1670
5. Hon. Warwick Robartes b. 27 Jul 1667
6. Hon. Essex Robartes b. 4 Apr 1669
About Tuesday 15 March 1663/64
San Diego Sarah • Link
Grief involves feelings of deep loneliness, a word that only came into being from around 1800, and then in relation to a religious state of ‘desolation’, akin to that experienced by Jesus in the wilderness. Widows' and widowers' desolation would be recognized as ‘oneliness’, a term that was similar to solitude, but had nothing to do with the modern emotion of loneliness. How could it? When God was there, one was never alone.
I'm glad Pepys had Elizabeth. I have serious doubts about his relationship with God. I'm glad John Evelyn had Mary Browne, plus I think he did have the relationship with God described above -- something few of us fully appreciate today. We know all about loneliness though.
Thoughts inspired by https://www.historytoday.com/misc…
About Sir Thomas Hervey (Navy Commissioner, 1665-8)
San Diego Sarah • Link
Sir Thomas Hervey has a biography on the House of Commons website -- he didn't qualify until well after the Diary ends:
https://www.historyofparliamenton…
About Rose (King St)
San Diego Sarah • Link
The Rose Tavern on King Street, close to Westminster Hall -- Pepys' and Doll Lane's haunt, which must have been very 'discrete' considering what they got up to there. Plus, on their first visit, Pepys was a little concerned by the people of quality who saw him leave (albeit alone, so they had nothing on him).
About Wednesday 7 November 1666
San Diego Sarah • Link
Pepys is trying to earn his hemp commission:
Friday 25 May 1666
"Then out to the ‘Change to speak with Captain [Cocke], who tells me my silver plates are ready for me, and shall be sent me speedily; and proposes another proposition of serving us with a thousand tons of hemp, and tells me it shall bring me 500l., if the bargain go forward, which is a good word."
L&M: Cocke is promising hemp futures WAY beyond his ability to deliver, and refers us to 27 July, 1666 http://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/1… etc.
L&M: Cocke was asking an inflated price of £57 per ton for this, making the whole deal worth £57,000.
https://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/…
About Monday 5 November 1666
San Diego Sarah • Link
Thanks, Buffalo Gal ... I was interested to see that the second one giving thanks for William III's intervention called for a blessing on King George, so more poking around to find the date of its adoption is called for. I suppose it would be "bad form" for William to introduce this idea in his lifetime.
About Wednesday 5 November 1662
San Diego Sarah • Link
"It should be noted that at this time, it was probably the Pope who was being burned in effigy, not Guy Fawkes on the bonfires."
According to this article, pope-burning went out during the 1640's, and wasn't revived until an apprentice riot in the 1670's. So when Pepys talks about bonfires, that is what he's seeing. No guys. No popes.
http://www.moyak.com/papers/popis…
About Gunpowder Plot Day
San Diego Sarah • Link
The Bonfire Night celebration on November 5 was fireworks (probably community-based, as now) and local bonfires (probably raked up autumn leaves, plus whatever needed to be burned from their homes and shops). Before Cromwell they often burned the pope in effigy.
In the 1670's a pamphlet, The Burning of the Whore of Babylon, gives us a description of the first spontaneous pope-burning since the 1640's that was held during the celebrations commemorating the discovery of the Gunpowder Plot on November 5, 1673. The author reports the apprentices decided "to make a new addition (to a parade) with a large effigy of the whore of Babylon dressed up with all the popish ornaments."
The author described how the Pope "was carried not in a chair, but as a traytor's head upon the Bridge, fixed upon a pole in procession all about the Poultrey market place, attended with near an hundred torches, and more than a thousand people."
http://www.moyak.com/papers/popis…
They also had a special church service giving thanks for the deliverance of James I and VI.
http://cbladey.com/guy/html/litur…
About Saturday 11 February 1659/60
San Diego Sarah • Link
All this nostalgia about "Guy Fawkes" Night is very previous. It was just bonfires (probably raking up the autumn leaves, and adding whatever needed to be burned from their homes and shops). Before Cromwell they burned the pope in effigy.
In the 1670's a pamphlet, The Burning of the Whore of Babylon, gives us a description of the first spontaneous pope-burning since the 1640's that was held during the celebrations commemorating the discovery of the Gunpowder Plot on November 5, 1673. The author reports the apprentices decided "to make a new addition (to a parade) with a large effigy of the whore of Babylon dressed up with all the popish ornaments."
The author described how the Pope "was carried not in a chair, but as a traytor's head upon the Bridge, fixed upon a pole in procession all about the Poultrey market place, attended with near an hundred torches, and more than a thousand people."
http://www.moyak.com/papers/popis…
They also had a special church service giving thanks for the deliverance of James I and VI.
http://cbladey.com/guy/html/litur…
About Monday 5 November 1666
San Diego Sarah • Link
"The fall of rents was a common complaint of landlords at this time."
Both Ormonde and Peterborough complaining of this today ... one in Ireland, and who knows where Peterborough's lands were.
Yesterday we found out that last March the Middlesex JP's got a nasty note from the Treasurer Earl of Southampton for not being diligent enough collecting the excise from a baker in Twickenham.
Why? My guess is that the plague had affected a lot of areas, and the dry summer probably means there was a bad harvest. The man in Twickenham would have been affected by both the impress of able-bodied men (which was before the harvest) and the loss of business due to the plague.
Or were people simply resisting paying for the wealthy merchants' war?
The elections around this time show local gentlemen being returned, with the cry of "No more courtiers". The country party versus the court party was shaping up.
Probably it's both resistance and inability.
About Monday 5 November 1666
San Diego Sarah • Link
Since we are discussing the alternative narratives about the Great Fire, you might be interested to read a fun novel about the adventures of 1666 by a true historian, J.D. Davies, who likes to also explore his knowledge creatively.
He published DEATH'S BRIGHT ANGEL as part of the 350th anniversary of these events. The last 40 pages are devoted to evidence that was withheld at the time, or narratives from people published decades later and ignored by historians who like the contemporary explanation that it was an accident.
There really is room for doubt here.
Old Street Historical Fiction
ISBN 978-1-910400-46-3
About Sunday 4 November 1666
San Diego Sarah • Link
"... and so to other discourse of the ill state of things, of which all people are full of sorrow and observation ..."
Widespread depression. I suggest picking up a shovel and doing some manual labor. Or hammer some planks. Maybe open a soup kitchen.
http://www.historic-uk.com/Histor…
St. Katharine Cree Church, built in 1631 (tower from 1504).
Although the church was damaged during the Great Fire of London, enough of the structure remained to provide a temporary 'soup kitchen' to the local workers who were rebuilding the city.
About Sunday 4 November 1666
San Diego Sarah • Link
'... and there began to read “Potter’s Discourse upon 666,” which pleases me mightily, ...'
This is funny. Obviously I haven't read Potter’s Discourse, but we just had Halloween, and tomorrow is the Gunpowder Plot holiday. It sounds like Pepys might as well be reading "The Shining" or watching a horror movie, and loving it. I hope it helps him sleep well tonight.
About Friday 1 September 1665
San Diego Sarah • Link
Charles, 2nd Earl of Norwich's and Gen. George, Lord Goring's sister, Lady Catherine Goring married Edward Scott of Scot's Hall and had several children, whose paternity her husband refused to acknowledge, on the grounds of her notorious infidelity (Prince Rupert was said to be her lover).
Mr. Scott belatedly acknowledged Lady Catherine Goring Scott's son, Thomas Scott, as his lawful son.
In 1663 this Thomas Scott married Caroline Carteret, daughter of our Sir George Carteret.
About Saturday 3 November 1666
San Diego Sarah • Link
The House of Commons are discussing the sale of Goring House.
Before the Civil Wars it was the home of George Goring, 1st Earl of Norwich. As good Royalists, the Earl and his first son, Gen. George, Lord Goring, both ended up on the continent. Gen. George become a Catholic convert and died penniless in Madrid in 1657, aged 49. He was buried in the English Jesuit chapel of St. George in Madrid.
The Earl of Norwich died in January 1663 in Brentwood, so apparently he didn't regain title to the house at the Restoration. His second and surviving son, Charles became the 2nd Earl of Norwich, but had no children.
In 1665 Henry Bennet became the Baron of Arlington and coincidentally took up residence at Goring House, so my guess is that Charles II kept the title to the house and rewarded Bennet for his years of service with it.
If that's the case, Arlington will pay Charles II a few thousand ... fundraising any way they can.
About Friday 2 November 1666
San Diego Sarah • Link
This article has moved to https://www.hyperion-records.co.u…
You can find it about half way through the record reviews.
About Friday 2 November 1666
San Diego Sarah • Link
This entry by Pepys is the first evidence that English trumpeters were beginning to play composed music, although no trumpet parts in English music have survived until after the late 1680s.
Before now, the trumpet was used as a fanfare instrument, used in armies and at courts to invest ceremonial with grandeur. Trumpeters usually played in bands, supported by timpani, using a semi-improvised repertory based on one or two chords.
The first experiments with using trumpets in composed music were made in German church music around 1620,
although it seems that trumpets were not used in instrumental music until after 1650.
The earliest dated sonata for trumpets and strings is by Vincenzo Albrici and was written between 1652 and 1654 when he was director of the Italian musicians at the Swedish court.
Albrici is important for the history of English trumpet music because he worked in London in the 1660s. In 1664 James, Duke of York asked him to press trumpeters to work at sea, so apparently they were used for audible communications during the Second Anglo-Dutch war (or at least James wanted to try that).
For more on early trumpetry in classical music:
http://www.goear.com/listen/c021d…
About Ware, Hertfordshire
San Diego Sarah • Link
A Pepys quote and a picture of the Great Bed of Ware
https://qz.com/quartzy/1714155/th…
About Saturday 21 February 1662/63
San Diego Sarah • Link
“Covenants, without the sword, are but words and of no strength to secure a man at all.” -- Thomas Hobbes (1588 -1679) – Leviathan