Matty asks if the OED considers Pepys' diary a citable source. Answer: definitely, they cite it frequently, as for example in the citations for "model" Cum Grano Salis quotes above.
Like Todd, I found this one of the most confusing entries I've read in the Diary. Martha's synopsis is most helpful, and sounds quite reasonable. But I still puzzle over two passages: "he told me about Sturbridge last was 12 months or 2 years he was at Brampton", and "the former part of this he did not speak fully so bad nor as certain what he could say" Does the L&M text agree with these wordings? Can someone explain what they mean?
pronounce Jesse's and Salty's notes make it clear that there's more to this than I realized when I wrote my earlier annotation. However, after studying the OED material Mr. Salt has provided, I believe my first thought was correct, that Sam was referring to Pierce's diction rather than the speech act he was performing.
Reason: "pronounce" in the sense of 'declare authoritatively' is not a verb that admits of adverbs describing the quality of the act ("well", "best", "badly"). It has this property in common with similar verbs such as "assert" or "declare". You would not say "He asserted that she was the one in charge, but he did so poorly," or "The founding fathers declared their independence from England very well." And the surviving uses of "pronounce" in this sense behave similarly: you would not hear someone after a wedding saying that "The minister pronounced them man and wife quite well."
On the other hand, "pronounce" in the sense of 'plums in mouth' does frequently appear with such adverbs, and that is how Sam uses it here.
"he is the only man I know that I could learn to pronounce by" That is, Pierce has the most prestigious English pronunciation Sam has heard, the only person whose speech Sam considers superior to his own.
the great Dutchman, aka the German giant, 9 1/2 feet tall
From Edward J. Wood, "Giants and dwarfs":
Pepys, on August 15th, 1664, was "at Charing-cross, and there saw the great Dutchman that is come over, under whose arm I went with my hat on, and could not reach higher than his cye-browes with the tip of my fingers. He is a comely and well-made man, and his wife a very little but pretty comely Dutch woman. It is true, he wears pretty high-heeled shoes, but not very high, and do generally wear a turban, which makes him show yet taller than really he is."
In 1664 was published an engraving of this giant and his wife; he is described as being a German, and nine feet and a half high. Appended are English verses in several compartments.
The following is a copy of an original handbill announcing the exhibition of tliis man; on it was an engraving representing him with his wife on one side holding his hand ; and on the other a male spectator, whose arm the giant was spanning; his thumb and finger reaching from the point of the man's extended forefinger to the bend of his arm.
"The true Effigies of the German Giant, now to be seen at the Swan, near Charing Cross, whose stature is nine foot and a half in height, and the span of his hand a cubit compleat. He goes from place to place with his wife, who is but of an ordinary stature, and takes money for the shew of her husband."
And there is a portrait of this gentleman, named M. Christopher Miller, at http://bibliodyssey.blogspot.com/… Scroll down about halfway through the long page, past pictures of other prodigies of the past. Unfortunately this picture of Miller has no humans of ordinary stature beside him as a point of reference. I did not find an image of the handbill Wood referred to.
Glyn, thank you very much for organizing this. I have in fact bought my ticket and booked my room, and am looking forward very much to the event. I write here in hopes of encouraging many other Pepysians to be there, as it would be wonderful to be able to put faces and personae to your handles.
The orrery, a clockwork device for modeling the movements of the planets around the sun, was named for Roger's grandson Charles, the Fourth Earl.
Wikipedia: The first modern orrery was built circa 1704 by George Graham. Graham gave the first model (or its design) to the celebrated instrument maker John Rowley of London to make a copy for Prince Eugene of Savoy. Rowley was commissioned to make another copy for his patron Charles Boyle, 4th Earl of Orrery, from which the device took its name. This model was presented to Charles' son John, later the 5th Earl. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orre…
"Fancy" may not have been the dog's name. I have read English novels (not sure from which century) in which a country squire refers to his sporting hound as "my Fancy," where it is used as a term of endearment or pride, not a proper name. Wish I could have resurrected at least one such reference, but no luck.
All of the annotations to that entry warrant rereading to understand the issue, but Michael's post of an L&M note and Jeannine's expansion are particularly helpful:
Michael Robinson on Sun 27 May 2007, 01:49am "some high words with Sir W. Batten about canvas,..."
From the L&M note:-
'Cf. N[avy] W[hite] B[ook], p. 222 (26 May): 'I stopped at a full Board, Collonell Reames being there, Sir W. Batten's project of bespeaking the W country cloth to be of 15 inches wide - or 18, which the Board seemed inclined to have. And very high Sir W. Batten was with me how he should not understand a sail better than I.' Pepys (relying on the advice of sail-makers and on the Dutch example) argued the broad canvas, with few seams, which was both cheaper and stronger. See notes in NWB, pp. 21+."
Jeannine, over to your source for further details ...
jeannine on Sun 27 May 2007, 11:39pm "Pepys (relying on the advice of sail-makers and on the Dutch example) argued the broad canvas, with few seams, which was both cheaper and stronger." Michael, over the course of a few months Sam has entries about the qualities of the different materials (Holland's duck vs. West Country duck vs. Suffolk cloth, etc.) used to make [sails]. He also collects information about the issue of the width of the cloth and how a narrower cloth needs more seams. Sam researches where most of the [sails] break apart due to wear and he finds it is on the seams, thus making a broader cloth a better choice as it requires fewer seams. Mennes supports that the seams have tended to give way first as based on his experience on the 'Henry' in 1661. (Spoiler) This talk won't end here today.
Oh, I don't think so, Terry. It would have to be very hard plaster indeed to have the acoustic properties of tile. Plastered walls offer a nice happy medium between the brightness of stone or tile and the mellowness of wood panel (forget about tapestries, which deaden the room too much for music). And the acoustics of plaster can vary according to how smooth or rough the surface is, so a skilled plasterer can "tune" the room to the owner's taste.
"no breache to my oathe" This is surprising. The last we heard, Sam's oath would be satisfied when he attained a net worth of 1000L, which he has now done. Has he made a new oath without telling us about it?
Parsing Pepys' pronouns Terry, I puzzled over the same passage before reading your post. I agree with your reference assignments in all but one case: "he [Penn] would have him [Falconer] make his [Falconer's] daughter his [Falconer's, not Penn's] heire." I can't think of any reason why Admiral Sir William Penn would make the daughter of the ropeyard clerk his heir. It sounds to me rather like Penn was urging Falconer not to marry so that Falconer's daughter would have an uncontested claim to his estate. Or at any rate that's how the second Mrs. Falconer reads it.
"I hope I can be forgiven wondering for an odd moment why Generall Soushe would be taking the Harmans to the Joyce's." I'm not sure if cape henry is serious here, or just twitting Sam for some slapdash prose. But of course it was talk of the general and his victory that the Coffee-house was full of, not the good general himself.
"having a master with us" I would take a different slant on this from Miss Lizzy. Having participated in musical sessions where there was a wide variation in the abilities of the participants, I can testify that it's less fun for everybody involved, even with good will on all sides. The less skilled feel intimidated by the pro, and the pro has to restrain himself or herself from running away with the piece. I'm not quite sure how Sam's word "ingenuity" fits into the picture, but I think I understand what he's saying.
Weavers and butchers I'm kind of surprised the weavers beat the butchers, since the butchers got more vigorous exercise in their trade, and presumably ate better, at least more meat.
Comments
First Reading
About Friday 26 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
Pedro, thanks for the link, which I've replicated under Huysman's own space in the Encyclopedia.
One of Huysman's portraits is of the three daughters of Thomas Crew, who were John Crew's grandchildren and Edward and Jemima Montagu's nieces.
About Jacob Huysmans
Paul Chapin • Link
From Pedro's posting to the 26 August 1664 entry:
Hiseman's, a picture drawer, a Dutchman.
For his pictures see...
http://www.npg.org.uk/live/search…
About Tuesday 23 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
Matty asks if the OED considers Pepys' diary a citable source.
Answer: definitely, they cite it frequently, as for example in the citations for "model" Cum Grano Salis quotes above.
About Wednesday 24 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
Sam, you're supposed to measure the space *before* you go furniture shopping.
About Monday 22 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
Like Todd, I found this one of the most confusing entries I've read in the Diary. Martha's synopsis is most helpful, and sounds quite reasonable. But I still puzzle over two passages:
"he told me about Sturbridge last was 12 months or 2 years he was at Brampton", and
"the former part of this he did not speak fully so bad nor as certain what he could say"
Does the L&M text agree with these wordings? Can someone explain what they mean?
About Wednesday 17 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
pronounce
Jesse's and Salty's notes make it clear that there's more to this than I realized when I wrote my earlier annotation. However, after studying the OED material Mr. Salt has provided, I believe my first thought was correct, that Sam was referring to Pierce's diction rather than the speech act he was performing.
Reason: "pronounce" in the sense of 'declare authoritatively' is not a verb that admits of adverbs describing the quality of the act ("well", "best", "badly"). It has this property in common with similar verbs such as "assert" or "declare". You would not say "He asserted that she was the one in charge, but he did so poorly," or "The founding fathers declared their independence from England very well." And the surviving uses of "pronounce" in this sense behave similarly: you would not hear someone after a wedding saying that "The minister pronounced them man and wife quite well."
On the other hand, "pronounce" in the sense of 'plums in mouth' does frequently appear with such adverbs, and that is how Sam uses it here.
About Wednesday 17 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
"he is the only man I know that I could learn to pronounce by"
That is, Pierce has the most prestigious English pronunciation Sam has heard, the only person whose speech Sam considers superior to his own.
About Monday 15 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
the great Dutchman, aka the German giant, 9 1/2 feet tall
From Edward J. Wood, "Giants and dwarfs":
Pepys, on August 15th, 1664, was "at Charing-cross, and there saw the great Dutchman that is come over, under whose arm I went with my hat on, and could not reach higher than his cye-browes with the tip of my fingers. He is a comely and well-made man, and his wife a very little but pretty comely Dutch woman. It is true, he wears pretty high-heeled shoes, but not very high, and do generally wear a turban, which makes him show yet taller than really he is."
In 1664 was published an engraving of this giant and his wife; he is described as being a German, and nine feet and a half high. Appended are English verses in several compartments.
The following is a copy of an original handbill announcing the exhibition of tliis man; on it was an engraving representing him with his wife on one side holding his hand ; and on the other a male spectator, whose arm the giant was spanning; his thumb and finger reaching from the point of the man's extended forefinger to the bend of his arm.
"The true Effigies of the German Giant, now to be seen at the Swan, near Charing Cross, whose stature is nine foot and a half in height, and the span of his hand a cubit compleat. He goes from place to place with his wife, who is but of an ordinary stature, and takes money for the shew of her husband."
http://books.google.com/books?id=…
And there is a portrait of this gentleman, named M. Christopher Miller, at http://bibliodyssey.blogspot.com/…
Scroll down about halfway through the long page, past pictures of other prodigies of the past. Unfortunately this picture of Miller has no humans of ordinary stature beside him as a point of reference. I did not find an image of the handbill Wood referred to.
About Tuesday 16 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
Glyn, thank you very much for organizing this. I have in fact bought my ticket and booked my room, and am looking forward very much to the event. I write here in hopes of encouraging many other Pepysians to be there, as it would be wonderful to be able to put faces and personae to your handles.
About Roger Boyle (Baron Broghill, Earl of Orrery)
Paul Chapin • Link
The orrery, a clockwork device for modeling the movements of the planets around the sun, was named for Roger's grandson Charles, the Fourth Earl.
Wikipedia: The first modern orrery was built circa 1704 by George Graham. Graham gave the first model (or its design) to the celebrated instrument maker John Rowley of London to make a copy for Prince Eugene of Savoy. Rowley was commissioned to make another copy for his patron Charles Boyle, 4th Earl of Orrery, from which the device took its name. This model was presented to Charles' son John, later the 5th Earl.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orre…
About Friday 12 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
"Fancy" may not have been the dog's name. I have read English novels (not sure from which century) in which a country squire refers to his sporting hound as "my Fancy," where it is used as a term of endearment or pride, not a proper name. Wish I could have resurrected at least one such reference, but no luck.
About Thursday 11 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
canvas
This argument harks back to the one recounted on 26 May: http://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/1…
All of the annotations to that entry warrant rereading to understand the issue, but Michael's post of an L&M note and Jeannine's expansion are particularly helpful:
Michael Robinson on Sun 27 May 2007, 01:49am
"some high words with Sir W. Batten about canvas,..."
From the L&M note:-
'Cf. N[avy] W[hite] B[ook], p. 222 (26 May):
'I stopped at a full Board, Collonell Reames being there, Sir W. Batten's project of bespeaking the W country cloth to be of 15 inches wide - or 18, which the Board seemed inclined to have. And very high Sir W. Batten was with me how he should not understand a sail better than I.' Pepys (relying on the advice of sail-makers and on the Dutch example) argued the broad canvas, with few seams, which was both cheaper and stronger. See notes in NWB, pp. 21+."
Jeannine, over to your source for further details ...
jeannine on Sun 27 May 2007, 11:39pm
"Pepys (relying on the advice of sail-makers and on the Dutch example) argued the broad canvas, with few seams, which was both cheaper and stronger."
Michael, over the course of a few months Sam has entries about the qualities of the different materials (Holland's duck vs. West Country duck vs. Suffolk cloth, etc.) used to make [sails]. He also collects information about the issue of the width of the cloth and how a narrower cloth needs more seams. Sam researches where most of the [sails] break apart due to wear and he finds it is on the seams, thus making a broader cloth a better choice as it requires fewer seams. Mennes supports that the seams have tended to give way first as based on his experience on the 'Henry' in 1661. (Spoiler) This talk won't end here today.
About Friday 5 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
Oh, I don't think so, Terry. It would have to be very hard plaster indeed to have the acoustic properties of tile. Plastered walls offer a nice happy medium between the brightness of stone or tile and the mellowness of wood panel (forget about tapestries, which deaden the room too much for music). And the acoustics of plaster can vary according to how smooth or rough the surface is, so a skilled plasterer can "tune" the room to the owner's taste.
About Saturday 6 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
Thank you, djc. The itinerary from Stevenage to Holborn via Welling, Kent made absolutely no sense.
About Thursday 4 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
"no breache to my oathe"
This is surprising. The last we heard, Sam's oath would be satisfied when he attained a net worth of 1000L, which he has now done. Has he made a new oath without telling us about it?
About Wednesday 3 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
Parsing Pepys' pronouns
Terry, I puzzled over the same passage before reading your post. I agree with your reference assignments in all but one case: "he [Penn] would have him [Falconer] make his [Falconer's] daughter his [Falconer's, not Penn's] heire." I can't think of any reason why Admiral Sir William Penn would make the daughter of the ropeyard clerk his heir. It sounds to me rather like Penn was urging Falconer not to marry so that Falconer's daughter would have an uncontested claim to his estate. Or at any rate that's how the second Mrs. Falconer reads it.
About Monday 1 August 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
"I hope I can be forgiven wondering for an odd moment why Generall Soushe would be taking the Harmans to the Joyce's."
I'm not sure if cape henry is serious here, or just twitting Sam for some slapdash prose. But of course it was talk of the general and his victory that the Coffee-house was full of, not the good general himself.
About Friday 29 July 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
"having a master with us"
I would take a different slant on this from Miss Lizzy. Having participated in musical sessions where there was a wide variation in the abilities of the participants, I can testify that it's less fun for everybody involved, even with good will on all sides. The less skilled feel intimidated by the pro, and the pro has to restrain himself or herself from running away with the piece. I'm not quite sure how Sam's word "ingenuity" fits into the picture, but I think I understand what he's saying.
About Friday 29 July 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
Robert, according to the link, and also the sense of the text, Cocke is the lady's name. The captain of the same name is not on the scene.
About Tuesday 26 July 1664
Paul Chapin • Link
Weavers and butchers
I'm kind of surprised the weavers beat the butchers, since the butchers got more vigorous exercise in their trade, and presumably ate better, at least more meat.